Regulations and payment

Hope you can help me with a bit of advice:

Just had some electrical work done for a new kitchen refit. It was to move and put in some new sockets (10) and change the location of light switches. Firstly wanted to check if I need any certification for this as my electrician is saying not?

Secondly bit of a query regarding payment.
He sent me a quote after coming out to view work saying 'I estimate to carry out the electrical work as discussed relating to your kitchen refit which includes 3 days labour will not be any more than £500.00. Any unforeseen extra costs will be discussed with you and quoted for separately'

However just received invoice and it's over £750!!! there has been no mention of extra costs while the job has been going on. I have nt asked for anything additional to happen. However he has been working for longer than the 3 days quoted, and repeatedly moaned how difficult my house is, and how hard the walls are. (Its victorian they built hard walls!)
Although I feel bad that it has taken him longer than anticipated, the walls have nt changed since he quoted me, and even as a novice I know that, so surely that should of been accounted for?
I was thinking of contacting him and stating will pay the £500 quoted for, but not the additional which has been added on.
As an aside most of his work is good, but there is a few niggly bits. He was a nightmare to deal with, so much attitude about my walls really unpleasent

Anyway thanks in advance for any advice

A few nightly bits? Could you expand on this, perhaps take some photos of the work so we can assess the quality of it?
Regarding the certificates, all electrical work requires a certificate to be given, notification to building control however is a different matter. If no new circuits were installed then notification may not have been required. We're they new circuits, or simply amending what was already there?

Never go with an ESTIMATE. Get a QUOTATION!

Estimates can vary, he is just giving you an estimation of what the cost are expected to be, but are not binding.
Quotations are fixed, but can vary after discussions for additional work etc.

Did his estimate include materials in the £500?

With extra days and materials, £750 is not unreasonable, just unexpected by you. Did he work hard? Did he stop and chat all the time? Did he keep shooting off? Did he have loads of breaks and extended lunches? If he worked hard, got the job done (and just moaned), then it's difficult to query the bill as it is an estimate, not a quote.

Certification should always be provided for works like this, but not necessarily certification/notification from/to building control.

My spark's day rate is 200 quid, so sounds like 750 is about right for what your guy had to do to supply and fit the necessaries to your place

Yes you should have some paperwork either an Electrical Minor Works Certificate or an Electrical Installation Certificate if not new circuits i.e. you don't have any new MCB's used in consumer unit then Electrical Minor Works Certificate is enough.

In Wales you would also need a complacence or completion certificate under Part P laws, but in England for kitchens when no new circuit has been installed that has been dropped. So if a new MCB or RCBO has been used then also a complacence or completion certificate is required.

As to time and cost very hard to say. I remember watching my son using a chasing tool and it was so much faster than hammer and chisel and we do expect professionals to use items like SDS drills which can handle hard bricks much better than the old hammer drills. But there is nothing to say they must and some times soft plaster can fall off walls with SDS where with the old hammer drill you can get away with it.

As already said estimate is not the same as a quote and even with a quote it's easy to authorise extra work without realising what you have done. I remember a friend who's wife was hovering over the tradesman all day and in conversation would ask can't that go there or it would be nice if this could be done. Only to find these had been taken as instructions and they were charged for the extra work.

In business we state things like all alterations to contract must be in writing, but for domestic that's rare.

Thanks everyone for all your replys. In answer to queries:

I asked for quote. He has emailed what he calls a 'quote' which within it stated 'estimate to carry out the electrical work as discussed relating to your kitchen refit which includes 3 days labour will not be any more than £500.00' At the time of booking he knew I was working to a budget so told me it was 'worst-case' scenario, and yes labour and materials. Hence why I am surprised it is greater.

No new circuits, no amendments to RCD. He did mention would nt need certification, but I m worried about if I sell and needing something? Even just a minor works certificate? Or would invoice (where he has detailed work suffice?)

I think his work is ok but the niggles are things like where I have 2 doubles sockets on a wall near each not at all level (one is ~7cm higher) so looks bad; other workmen said it was shocking he was holding all the sockets in with expanding foam? He's said I need to go up in loft to replace all the insulation back where it was as he wont. All the sockets he's left hanging for me to paint around; but not left any screws, he's moved a socket as too close to washing machine, but the wire is now too long, and rather than chasing into wall like he said it's looped around socket before going being plugged in.

He is charging for 27 hours; which is about ~3 hours over his 3days work estimate @8/hour days. He never worked a full day, just kept popping in to do a little bits (his choice). He was late every day I booked him in for 3 months ago - earliest start was 10am, never there after 2pm, so yes it was more days than I was expecting, but not a lot of more hours. Yes constantly on phone, or chatting to other workmen etc.

So I m getting charged ~£250 extra for 3 hours extra time; an unchanged job and he has nt informed me of an additional costs during the three weeks. I never want to withhold money for someone if they had genuinely ran over due to unforseen reasons, but I cant see there has been any and bit unsure how to broach it?

blowsbubbles said:

Thanks everyone for all your replys.

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Do I take it that you are the same person as Gemstar?

Kind Regards, John

blowsbubbles said:

No new circuits, no amendments to RCD. He did mention would nt need certification, but I m worried about if I sell and needing something? Even just a minor works certificate? Or would invoice (where he has detailed work suffice?)

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He may possibly have been meaning that it did not need 'notification' to the Local Authority, with the certificates associated with that process. However, to all intents any purposes, any electrical work should result in the electrician providing a certificate, if only a minor works one.

blowsbubbles said:

So I m getting charged ~£250 extra for 3 hours extra time

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If that is correct, it obviously doesn't make a lot of sense if he was charging you £500 for the first three days. In your position, I would be asking him to explain/justify that. If the original estimate was stated in terms of 'days', are you sure that he calculates on the basis of 8 hours/day? If not, then the 27 hours total might be (in his mind) a lot more than 3 hours over "3 days".

Kind Regards, John