Am I being given the right advice on renewing flat roof?

[novice1967]

I have a small 6'x10' 2 storey extension with a leaking 25 year old flat roof.
I've had a couple of contractors round to assess and quote to replace it.

The first guy quoted around £800 to completely strip felt, put down a membrane then 2 layers of felt, remove 2 layers of roof tiles for the flashing, then aluminium round the edges. He isn't a NFRC member but has been in business a long time and says he will give a 20 year guarantee.

The second guy is a member of the NFRC and quoted £600 to strip old felt, lay a 4mm membrane underlay and he said one layer of 4.5mm mineral finish. He would put lead flashing under the tiles. When I asked about 3 layers, he said that was an 'old school' technique and that nowadays, with the newer, thicker felts, only one layer was necessary. He also showed me his Gold Heritage card and some pictures of his work. He will give a 10 year guarantee but said it would last 20-25 years easily.

Now I am totally confused and would really appreciate some help from anyone in the know.

Thanks very much.

 

[cotswoldbuilders]

For the extra £200 go with the first guy, 2 underlays with a top coat and 20yr gaurantee.

 

[novice1967]

Only trouble with the 1st guy is that he hasn't as yet given me a written quote despite me chasing him up. Also, if hes not a member of the NFRC, then I'm not sure how a guarantee would be of any use?

 

[Dean7777]

Your better of getting a epdm flat roofing system, will easily outlast polyester torch on felt. The price quoted is roughly £100.00 per m2 which is about right, however you should make sure that they change any defective decking or renewal all of it.

 

[Nige F]

Only trouble with the 1st guy is that he hasn't as yet given me a written quote despite me chasing him up. Also, if hes not a member of the NFRC, then I'm not sure how a guarantee would be of any use?

Sounds to me like number 2 is better - Which one looks less like a Pie Key

 

[RWDave]

Your better of getting a epdm flat roofing system, will easily outlast polyester torch on felt. The price quoted is roughly £100.00 per m2 which is about right, however you should make sure that they change any defective decking or renewal all of it.

£100 per m2 is a little bit high if you ask me, for felt anyway!

But i agree with Dean, EPDM is far superior and longer lasting.

We have over 500 trained contractors on board with us that are Firestone EPDM trained installers, so finding someone isnt difficult.

If you need any contacts just chuck me an email!

 

[novice1967]

Thanks for your replies.
The second guy appeared more professional, but appearances can't always be trusted! He did say he would repair any defective boards, the first guy would as well, but would add on another £150 to the £800 if they needed replacing, which takes the job to nearly £1,000 -bit steep in my opinion!

My main concern is the method. EPDM sounds like the the best, but if it is at a price, then I am happy to go with felt, particularly as I may well move in the next few years.

Is the second guy correct in saying that 2 layers are sufficient? His quote states:

"Supply and fix ‘torch-on’high performance felt, first layer 4mm underlay and top layer 4.5 mm mineral finish, fully bonded to underlying layer (Materials to BS 747), to form new flat roof covering.
Supply and fix new pipe slate."

Any thoughts/comments welcomed!
Thanks again for reading.

 

[RWDave]

The way i look at it is like this;

EPDM (Firestone) costs about £15 per m2 for supplys, thats the EPDM, adhesives, trims etc
epdm
Decking and other materials on top of this, most of our contractors fit epdm for around £50-£60 per m2, thats with new boards too.

Whats the overall m2 of your roof?

If its a high performance felt it will last a long time, if its a budget felt it will have shorter life-span.

If your happy with the contractor, and he has a portfolio of work carried out etc then you shouldnt have any problems.

I hope this helps, i dont want to make it sound like "Felt is crap, use EPDM" because felt has been used for many many years and is still a good membrane, but EPDM is just another option.

 

[SurreyRoofingEstimator]

Square metre rates aren't always best gauge when looking at total price, it will take as long to do that roof as one twice the size so the smaller it is the more it will be per sqm

 

[festive]

I have a small 6'x10' 2 storey extension with a leaking 25 year old flat roof.
I've had a couple of contractors round to assess and quote to replace it.

The first guy quoted around £800 to completely strip felt, put down a membrane then 2 layers of felt, remove 2 layers of roof tiles for the flashing, then aluminium round the edges. He isn't a NFRC member but has been in business a long time and says he will give a 20 year guarantee.

Thanks very much.

A word on guarantees...from NFRC website.

Ask for a guarantee on new or refurbishment work. NFRC offers guarantee schemes which back up, but are independent of, the contractor’s own guarantee. Remember that even the best contractors can go out of business whereupon their own guarantees become worthless, so make sure you will be covered.

So basically being a member doesn't automatically give you a guarantee, you have to arrange for it?!

And my 'local' roofing company offered 25years gurantee, the fibreglass flat roof they laid started bubbling up come the next summer and they were already out of business.

 

[Xenon]

You have been advised correctly regarding number of layers, however, it would be usual to put a nailed layer down as a flame retardent first on timber deck.

There are self adhesive underlays available, which are activated when the Mineral is torched on to achieve bond.

Sounds like they have both priced for a basic HT felt, which will be fine. For £600 i'd want it insulated as well. EPDM is the cheapest of single ply solutions and would not be recommended by me, but thats because of experience of its failings on a larger scale.

 

[Xenon]

Your better of getting a epdm flat roofing system, will easily outlast polyester torch on felt. The price quoted is roughly £100.00 per m2 which is about right, however you should make sure that they change any defective decking or renewal all of it.

£100 per m2 is a little bit high if you ask me, for felt anyway!

But i agree with Dean, EPDM is far superior and longer lasting.

For £100 M2 I can install an insulated Bauder system. EPDM far superior? Don't talk rubbish man ! How many site visits will you get at every stage of installation? What type of insurance backed cast iron single point warranty is supplied?

 

[Zeberdee]

EPDM is a better product IMO.

Fit as many layers of felt as you want, But over time it will fail and leak because of the joins and over time the expansion and contraction will eventually see them joins fail.

EPDM however wont fail IMO, As there is no joins on most flat roofs, It expands, and contracts without splitting.

No brainer really.

 

[Xenon]

EPDM is a better product IMO.

Fit as many layers of felt as you want, But over time it will fail and leak because of the joins and over time the expansion and contraction will eventually see them joins fail.

EPDM however wont fail IMO, As there is no joins on most flat roofs, It expands, and contracts without splitting.

No brainer really.

And there are the words of a man that know absolutely nothing about felt.

As previously, what cast iron insurance backed single point guarantees do you get with EPDM? How many times is it inspected by manufacturers tech dept during installation? What license do you need from the manufacturer to install it?

Its a single answer....None. Its loved by those looking for cheap installation giving maximum profit, and anyone can install it with minimal plant.

 

[novice1967]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

I am hearing lots of good things about EPDM, but really, I just want a reasonably priced solution to my small, leaking roof.

Are 3 layers better than 2?

I feel more confident about the roofer who is quoting for 2 layers, probably because I found his details on the NFRC website. He said that 3 layers are a bit 'old school' and that with the modern thicker mineral felts, 2 layers were more than enough.

Having absolutely no experience in this field, I am completely in the hands of the professionals, hence my post here, hoping for some impartial advice.

Thank you.