Baumatic Cooker tripping Mains fuse intermittently HELP Pls

[BlowingBubbles]

I have a problem with a Baumatic BT2385. Grill with fan trips main fuse, sometimes immediately, sometimes when it has been on for a short time. Engineer here yesterday replaced function selector switch. Went to pre-heat oven in evening, on fan oven, warmed up for 10 mins then it tripped everything. It is the intermittent nature of the fault which is driving me mad. Oven can work perfectly for weeks even months then (after I tried to use grill for second time in life of appliance) trips board again.

I had electricity checked out and the sensitively of the trip was tested and found to be within unacceptable range. My dilemma is whether it is an appliance fault or my electricity. I can't afford a new cooker but first engineer a few months ago replaced switch (same one I think as yesterdays engineer) the fan, an element and I thought it was sorted but same problem is back. Do I get rid of the cooker or start with another electrical check ? Help Christmas will be a nightmare if it is still playing up.

Incidentally I just found another person who posted on another site last month with same fault on a Baumatic. She received no answers but had been advised elsewhere both elements needed to be replaced. Any advice really appreciated.

 

[zipper]

I had electricity checked out and the sensitively of the trip was tested and found to be within unacceptable range

???

 

[JohnD]

when you say "main fuse" I have a feeling you mean "RCD" and not "main fuse"

Please describe the thing that blows or trips, and what is written on it.

How old is the cooker?

What do you know about the qualification and skills of the person you had in?

If you can post a photo of your consumer unit ("fusebox") that may help. If it has a door, open it so we can see what's inside. Don't unscrew the cover.

p.s.
A main fuse is usually 60 to 100 Amps, adjacent to the meter, and inside a black or grey plastic enclosure like

Cut out Detail

• Amy_B
• 8 Mar 2009
• 2

Cut out Detail

or

New Service Head

• macman81
• 3 Jun 2008
• 2

 

[BlowingBubbles]

I had electricity checked out and the sensitively of the trip was tested and found to be within unacceptable range Hi Zipper, that is how he explained it to me. He loaded the circuit and measured at which point it tripped. Apologies if I use wrong terminology, I am an elderley lady who doesn't fully understand these things

John D, the switch that trips is a solitiary blue switch to the right of main board. I will try to upload a photo, just need to work out how ! The cooker is 4 yers old but has had light use. I live alone and don't use it every night. My electrician is great, I totally trust him. Father and two sons and they are all excellent and fully qualified.

From what I can gather over the years there have been lots of people with the same problem and the name Baumatic comes up a lot. Suggestion that it can be the bottom element breaking down and earthing ? seems a favourite. I am just dreading starting the endless round of visits and revisits replacing everything replaceable which happened before and still having the fault with Xmas on the horizon

 

[BlowingBubbles]

it is the blue and white switch in top right corner

Thanks for your help x[/img]

 

[JohnD]

John D, the switch that trips is a solitiary blue switch to the right of main board. I will try to upload a photo, just need to work out how ! The cooker is 4 yers old but has had light use.

This switch is probably an RCD, which trips when electrical current leaks to earth, due to a fault. It can be recognised because it will have a button marked "T" or "Test" which you are supposed to press every few months to verify that the safety device is still working and does not seize. You may have seen small RCD adaptors that people use with lawnmowers and other garden tools in case they cut through the flex.

It is quite common for oven heating elements, as they age, to have the insulation break down, or become damp, and this causes electrical leakage. If the oven has not been used for some tome, or is in damp conditions, you can sometimes cure it by heating it up often enough to stay dry; however if it is breaking down with age, the element has to be replaced.

An extra complication is that, depending on the layout of your consumer unit, it may have one RCD controlling several circuits. An RCD trips when it reaches a defined, small leakage current, so that it turns off the power before it becomes dangerous. So if you have, for example, a tiny leak on the immersion heater, and a tiny leak on an outside lamp, and a tiny leak on the central heating pump, none of which is on its own big enough to be dangerous, one more tiny leak from the oven may, added to all the others, reach the tripping point. You can get an idea of this by unplugging all appliances, especially watery ones or those with a heating element (this is where earth leakage usually occurs) or switching off at the wall fixed appliances like an immersion heater which do not have a plug, and seeing if the oven still causes a trip. This may prompt a different way of curing the problem.

If you can post a pic of the CU it may suggest the best way to deal with the problem. Instructions are on //www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=129539

Edited:
I have now seen your pic. Yes, it is an RCD, and it appears to be a single one that controls all the circuits in the house. Have a look and see what numbers are on it. It is likely to say "30mA" or "0.03A or "100mA" or "0.1A" or something like that.

The consumer unit is fairly old and it may not be simple to upgrade it as I was thinking.

I see you have two CUs; this usually occurs when an additional one is fitted later for an electric shower, extension or garage. Do you know which circuits are controlled by each?

Do you live in the country with an overhead power supply?

The pic is a bit blurry, if you can take one with Flash it may come out sharper. Open the transparent doors please.

p.s. have a look inside the CU at the larger switch each has, and see what is written on it - there may be an additional RCD inside the CU

 

[Burnerman]

It could be that the grill has two elements - one for just part of the grill and one for the complete grill - as per some Zanussi types - if so, both should be changed.
If the electrics hold in when the cooker itself is used, it would appear that the fault must lie with the fan, element(s), switch or wiring to them.....
John

 

[BlowingBubbles]

Thanks JohnD and burnerman. Board is high up so due to poor mobility I can't get up to take a better photo. A delivery man just had a look and said the blue and white switch which trips says 80A / 30mA

I don't have overhead cables. the bathroom and shower is quite new although done by previous owner. Garage has it's own small fuse box. Logic tels me if it was a wiring / electrical fault it would happen with hobs and always not just intermittently.

Common denominators are selector switch, now replaced twice by two different engineers, fan which the first engineer did something with ? and I think he replaced one element. Mad thing is because Baumatic have no record of work done and bits replaced, second engineer seems to be about to go through the same elimination processes which didn't work before ! I am leaning towards both elements needing changing as burnerman suggests which has come up for someone else on another forum. I'm fed up With hospital and health issues I've got enough on my plate, or rather I haven't 'cus I can't cook my dinner !

 

[Burnerman]

So, its definitely just the cooker that upsets things.....the breaker stays in when you use the kettle, washing machine and other high current appliances?
I know that these trips can be very sensitive - my own is a 100mA trip which is less sensitive than yours, and even that has popped on occasion when a spotlamp blew and once when a hob plate developed a loose connection.
I'm wondering why your electricity people just didn't replace the trip if they weren't happy with it?
John

 

[BlowingBubbles]

Hi John,

My electrician said trip was fine and he showed me how he tested it. I just seemed to be falling down the cracks of an appliance fault vs wiring/electicity fault.

It has tripped when a spotlight bulb has gone, but the oven seems to be the culprit. Hob works fine as do all other appliances. I have also had my plus sockets checked. It is just tht it is not all the time. I haven't tried to use it since Tuesday when engineer came and replaced function selector switch. He tried it and it worked, but later that evening I slected fan oven. It ran for about 15 mins then tripped. Other times it will trip immediately on turning on. Other times it will work OK for weeks/months, then this bout of problems was as a result of grill with fan which I hardly ever use.

 

[Burnerman]

I was just thrown a bit from your first post, commenting that the trip was 'not within acceptable range' - whatever that means....
Anyway, I suspect your cooker has either an element failing and leaking to earth or some wire insulation has the same issue - or the cooker connection cables simply aren't tight. Any sparky with the right gear can check all of that.
Mind you, its dead easy to be dead clever from the keys of a lap top!
Just wishing you well.....and I hope that your 'engineer' doesn't charge you!
John

 

[zipper]

Get a domestic appliance engineer to check out your cooker & megger test the elements properly. Your electrician ought to have been able to do this for you, but he can't seem to make his mind up what the problem is.

 

[BlowingBubbles]

John the burnerman, I have just read my original post and see why I confused you ! what a difference two letters i.e. UN placed before a word makes ! it should have said trip was not oversensitive and in an acceptable range. (looking for a smilie with Egg on its Face ....)

and thank you zipper and all. Engineer coming Monday. I did mention I had been on this Forum and there were a lot of folk who "knew their stuff ... " he didn't sound impressed and said he knew his stuff as well .....

The daft thing to me is Baumatic organised the first round of attempted repairs with one North Wales company, and although this is a continuation of that original problem, the second engineer does not have access to what was replaced originally. Baumatic said he would have, he said they are talking through their rear ends ..... well not exactly those words but you get the gist ! xxx

 

[Burnerman]

I sincerly hope they get it sorted for you on their next visit.....maybe you could kidnap the engineer until the cooker has gone through a couple of hours heating!
Please post back with the result....Zipper and I would pop down for lunch, but its a bit far!
Be lucky
John

 

[BlowingBubbles]

Well the engineer came back today ...... ran grill, oven with/without fan, got it very very hot, twiddled the knobs and it would not trip. He rang a mate who has been in the business for 30 years who said maybe wiring .... Was here for 30+mins, would not trip. Now I have a sneaky feeling that it will trip tonight when I am warming up my Levis Carribbean hot chilli beef .....or on Chrsitmas Day when I have my dinner cooking.

I ascertained earlier by refusing to take no for an answer from Baumatic (who had previously said they didn't have the info) original engineer had replaced main front selector switch, fan element and a commutator ? New engineer has also replaced the selector switch last Wednesday, after which it tripped in the evening.

Engineer said he checked the earth on bottom element and others ? and nothing showing. So his report will say No Fault Found. I asked if he would replace other elements to eliminate them as a possibility and he said Baumatic wouldn't wear it, but he would ask them the question as to whether he should.

No mention of thermal contact which came up elsewhere ?

I am really fed up and still faced with disposing of what maybe a good repairable cooker, which I can't really afford to do, or dreading the holidays if it keeps tripping.