Carbon Monoxide

[ChrisR]

A family had their Gloworm back boiler cleaned of soot a year ago, and fitted a CO alarm. They'd all been affected and went to hospital for checks.
One of them fell asleep in front of the TV last night, and the alarm woke her up at 2am - the CH was on 24hrs.
They had been getting headaches recently, but it hadn't occurred to them to check the boiler, even though they'd seen a few flakes of soot come out.

It's full of soot and I've capped it off.

Time to get a couple of CO detectors in stock.

 

[Alfredo]

The leading question is....when it was cleaned out previously did the operative look for what was causing it to soot. Impossible to guess, but in any event I am very nervous of turning any appliance back on that has sooted once. It doesn't soot up by accident does it, something has gone wrong to make it do it.

There was a time when i might have had a go at getting it working properly, but these days I'm far less inclined to try. Get it wrong..and...

Alfredo

 

[holty]

personally i think it should be law when any open flued boiler is serviced some sort of co2 alarm should be fitted. also piece of mind.

 

[ChrisR]

Entirely agree, both.
I told the guy I could spend 2 hours with it trying to make it OK, or find it couldn't be made OK. Advised him to spend the money on some oil filled rads to use until he gets it replaced. It'll be a combi in the loft - anyone want a nearly new Aquastream??

 

[ollski]

I always keep 5 co alarms on the van and always recommend them on anything open flued. The message seems to be getting though over the last couple of yeras but the majority would still rather take their chances than spend 30 quid.

 

[Soggy_weetabix]

Alfredo has hit the mark on this one. No mention of:

Flame picture one serviced.
Ventilation.
Gas pressures.
Flueing.

Why ignore the obvious? CO alarms are fantastic but not the backup when you cant be a&sed to find the real fault.

David

 

[Strachan]

I agree totally that these machines are potential life savers. But i also agree that if serviced correctly, and you are confident in your own ability, that they are a back up. If the government was so bothered about it they should give them out free as they do smoke alarms. By the way i`ve got the fire brigade coming next week to fit some freebies on my house. Take note vaillant representatives, i like free stuff!

 

[Paul Barker]

Best way to kill the sensor is expose it to a back boiler, cheaper to live with flue symptoms and headaches.

 

[ollski]

I agree totally that these machines are potential life savers. But i also agree that if serviced correctly, and you are confident in your own ability, that they are a back up. If the government was so bothered about it they should give them out free as they do smoke alarms. By the way i`ve got the fire brigade coming next week to fit some freebies on my house. Take note vaillant representatives, i like free stuff!

But the government aren't bothered as it isn't really anything to do with them. A service or annual check is important of course to minimise the risks but as with a car mot it is only a check on the day. They should be more recommended and their importance stressed though as a householder not caring about personal risk is one thing, but not caring about risk to anyone who visits the house is another. I had 3 calls to a bbf once because of smells, sore eyes etc. every time I fully stripped, cleaned and checked everything and there was no problem. I recommended a co.d but he was not interested at 30 quid decided he would leave a window open instead.....looked after his grandkids all day aswell. At risk is the very worst I could leave it and probably shouldn't even have left it at that.

 

[Paul Barker]

I have a few old ladies with my co detectors on loan. One was where husband had 6 months to live and needed to sleep downstairs for the duration. I haven't the heart to go and ask for my co detector back 'cause it's like calling in to see if he's dead yet if you know what I mean. He's probably died and she's got demensia and family will bin it.

I have another old couple have had to call me quite a few times but each time don't remember me. One visit the man said we'll buy you a bottle of wine at Christmas to which I said "no you won't, 'cause you won't remember". Anyhow every time I go and we have the who are you what are you doing here have you been here before period over with, I say don't forget you are buying me a bottle of wine for Christmas. They never remember though, so I know I won't get one. Bless them, they're so sweet aswell. We have a good laugh about it, but they never remember anything I teach them, it's hopeless, I just have to make sure they have my number in all the prominent places.

Then there was the old lady who let me in I started work and half way through she decided I was an intruder. Luckily a carer turned up and we sorted it out! Phew!

 

[Alfredo]

ollski says

"I had 3 calls to a bbf once because of smells, sore eyes etc. every time I fully stripped, cleaned and checked everything and there was no problem."

This is what we USED to do...but do you know Corgi now says if you are called to a potential CO incident all you can do is turn it off and call Transco (no, don't ask me why either). They are supposed to test for CO, but nobody's told them, and they don't agree anyway!!. Then before you can turn it on you have to send the headachees to hospital for a blood test..they need a note from their GP. (oursfax it through). If 1) they get the all clear, you can turn the appliance back on BUT if 2) They have CO poisoning you have to leave it turned off riddor it and inform the HSE....who may wish to investigate and do not want the appliance interfered with ( potential crime scene?)

I wouldn't have believed all this unless I had been was sat across the table from the Corgi rep telling us this.

So we are now sending anyone who even sneezes for a CO test..Its a waste of time and NHS resources, but thats what they have told us we have to do.

What have other gas guys found on this?

Alfredo

 

[Strachan]

I`ll add them to my list of no can dos. Along with microbore, biasis and women. It`ll make rgi`s more prone not to answer the callout if it`s a bfb. Who needs all that?

 

[ollski]

Thank god for that, no more transco follow ups, must say I haven't noticed it yet though I have done 2 last week.

 

[ChrisR]

The guy who fixed it a year ago was a corgi regd friend of theirs. He spent a long time with it and fitted the CO alarm. Seems reasonable to assume he checked burner rate and was happy with it. There's a floor vent, open plan and the door was open last night. The fire/boiler doesn't look old. There's no "third seal", but that's common.
Could be there's a problem with the flue, or the floor vent. It would be interesting to know, but would take time/money to find out, and to uncertain end.

None of them twigged that the boiler could be causing problems despite the signs over the last few weeks (soot flakes, smells, headaches), and they're smarting over that. But for the cheap gizmo on the wall, the teenage daughter might not have got up this morning, so I'm not surprised they don't cherish the boiler.
They also hate the look of it, need continuous showers and had been thinking of a replacement anyway.

I accept that BBU's can be fine - my mother's is always clean inside. But quite often , in dank weather, the flues don't pull all that well, and I have been less than 100% ecstatic about the odd one. I'll be writing to all landlords with them in future, strongly recommending a CO alarm.

 

[Alfredo]

I suppose I spend about 1/2 of my existence servicing Glow Worm BBU's as we have hundreds on the district and they are mosty trouble free, and we do get to do them once a year, and yes we have weeded quite a few out over the years, but i can't say I regard them that badly. We were glad to get rid of the last Capricorns earlier this year, they were getting a bit dodgy, so a policy decision was made to pull them out regardless of whether they passed or not.

One of or problems now is tenants faking headaches as their neighbours have got new combis, and they want one (Housing Assoc). They get a fright when we send them off to hospital, and often admit it was just a ploy..we still send them...can't afford not to..just in case. Crazy old world.

Alfredo (whos had a bad day today)