Do Kitchen Lever Bib Tap Upstands Develop Stress-problems?

[Catherine Barber]

I've been told that the Upstands of Lever-handled Kitchen Bib taps could develop stress/flexing problems with time, after the Lever handle has been operated (pushed and pulled) a great number of times?

Has anyone experienced a problem with this?

(It's only Kitchen Bib taps that I'm interested in finding out more about, as opposed to bathroom or garden taps).

Would also like to know of ANY problems, ie, leaking, that Lever Bib taps might develop, in comparison with ordinary taps.


'FLEXI TAILS' OR 'RIGID TAILS'?
I got a reply from a plumbing company/website about taps being able to have 'flexi tails' or 'rigid tails'.


I also got this reply from another plumbing forum:
"If any tap is mounted on a thin flexible sinktop - such as some stainless steel types - then using rigid copper pipes would help keep the tap steady and make it feel less floppy .
But, really, a tap should be able to support itself...

To help with 'wobbly' issues, you can get brackets/clamps for taps which fit on to the tap shaft after it's passed through the sinktop and which is also screwed to the surrounding worktop (if it's an inset sinktop). "

Would anyone know if having a 'rigid tail' would be an advantage for a Bib tap?
And whether one can obtain specific brackets/clamps to reduce any 'wobbliness' of the tap shaft/upstand?

 

[Madrab]

Depends on the installation. If they are standalone taps then using rigid copper up to the tap is no issue and is preferable.

Even if it's a monobloc, you can still use copper though the tails are smaller as some thin down to 10mm. Yes you can get a monobloc brace support, usually used when the S/S sink is thin and the metal flexes, when using a mixer tap with a swivel spout.

Any installation where copper is used and it's clipped properly will offer better stability than flexis.

Good quality 1/4 turn lever taps will perform as well as any other tap long term, IMO.

 

[muggles]

Rigid tap tails are always preferable - flexis will restrict the flow of water

 

[Catherine Barber]

Thanks so much for your helpful replies, Rob and Andrew!

My sink is stainless-steel. Yes, I want to have standalone lever-handled pillar taps or lever-handled bib taps with upstands/standpipes.
I'm also looking out for taps that are as tall, or taller than, my existing pillar taps, which measure 17cms (not including tap-head) from base to top of pillar.
I would like taps with as long a spout as possible - as long, or longer than, my existing tap's spouts, which measure 8cms.
And to have spouts as high, or higher than, my existing ones, which measure 11.5cms from base to spout.

If either of you - or anyone - knows of any taps like this, can you let me know?

Many thanks.

 

[muggles]

Can you post a photo of your existing tap?

 

[Catherine Barber]

Well..... hope I've done this right, and you can find the photo of my existing taps (including their measurements). It all looked very uncertain to me.
Let me know if nothing's come through - I'm a bit new to uploading photos!

 

[Burnerman]

Do choose quality taps when the time comes, Catherine.....lever arm types use a cartridge to control the water flow rather than a rubber washer - consequently the complete cartridge needs replacing when they go wrong. A quality tap will use cartridges that you can actually get, so called 'designer' ones somewhat less so.
Consider Bristan, who have a good spares back up.
If you are concerned about the taps flexing, it's simple enough to reinforce the underside of the sink.
John

 

[Catherine Barber]

Many thanks John for your helpful reply! Am I right that when you said 'the complete cartridge needs replacing when they go wrong' you were meaning just the cartridge needed replacing, and not the whole lever-tap-head that would need replacing....?

No - I wouldn't touch those rubbishy 'designer' type taps - I avoid 'designer' anything like the plague!
Yes, I've noted that there are quite a few taps made by Bristan. Francis Pegler and Pegler Yorkshire are other makes I've noticed.
I was told my existing kitchen pillar crosshead taps are 'Pegler Performa' [if you wish, see uploaded photo of these] and these must be circa-1974.

 

[Burnerman]

Yes, that's correct.....the cartridge (sometimes called an insert) contains ceramic discs that fit so closely together that water can't pass through - inevitably enough, they do wear and the cartridge needs to be renewed - the levers and so on remain the same.
The problem arises when new cartridges aren't available and then its new tap time.......unfortunately I've had loads of issues with taps that come from a certain Swedish furniture outlet and even more that come from discount supermarkets
Lunns.net are one of the major aftermarket suppliers of cartridges......if they can't find what's needed then its game over.
The older traditional screw down rubber washer taps theoretically last a lifetime - as yours have proved! The Pegler tap was a leader in its day.
John

 

[Catherine Barber]

Ah - ceramic discs! That was something I was rather keen to have as well, as I liked the idea of quarter-turn taps. Actually, I have had to have the rubber washers on my existing kitchen taps changed about 3 or 4 times in the last 33 years that Ive lived in my flat, so maybe it'd be no different with ceramic discs.....?
But my plumber told me, last time he ground down the tap's seating because it had a slight split in it (tap was dripping), that, next time, I should replace the taps.

And - huh - think I can guess which Swedish furniture outlet you're meaning! No, I wouldn't go there for anything like taps - this store's customer service is not only appalling, it's pretty much non-existant. Nor would I fancy those discount supermarkets, or even buying taps on Ebay? - Im guessing the best way to buy taps is ordering direct from the makers? ie, from quality makers like Bristan or Pegler?

Thanks also for telling me about Lunns.net.

 

[Burnerman]

I think your taps deserve a place in the Tap Museum.....your disc ceramics won't last anywhere near as long.
Your quality taps should come from the makers or their distributors. For example we have a 'proper' plumbers merchant up here called Crosslings which is a million times better than a DIY shed.
Bristan has a good website, with the range displayed with prices and spares.....worth a look!
Whoever fits the new taps, ask them to connect them using copper rather than flexible pipes - you'll get much better flow this way.
John

 

[Catherine Barber]

Yes, they certainly built things to last, back then. Now it's all built-in obsolescence - just to make you spend more money to have to buy new things, because, I'm told, it keeps 'the economy' going(!). Meanwhile, our landfills just keep on getting bigger.

Thanks too for all the other useful info - I'll look up Bristan - and Crosslings too (though Berkshire (where I live) is a long way from Northumberland).
I like the idea of 'proper' trade merchants/suppliers, rather than these 'DIY' mass-produced emporia.
And I wouldn't be sure about buying something like taps on Ebay either - would you.....?

I'm guessing that using copper rather than flexible (plastic?) pipes would help keep the tap upstands/pillars steadier, and less prone to 'flexing' when using the lever handles?

 

[Burnerman]

Rigid copper pipes will help support the tap to some degree, but in real life I seriously doubt if you'd notice.....a better move is to support the new taps from underneath the sink using a piece of thickish ply, with two holes drilled in for the tap tails to pass through. Obviously if you end up choosing a monobloc tap, this isn't possible.
I wouldn't buy taps from ebay (anorak on now - the one with the furry hood ) when the contract range from Toolstation are really rather good!
John

 

[Catherine Barber]

Actually - I may not have made this clear - but I'm looking into getting lever-handled kitchen bib taps with upstands/standpipes, as I really love the look of these, and they also look nice and tall. I had a concern that problems might develop with the upstand being constantly flexed by the pushing and pulling of the lever handles over a period of time, and I wanted to hear if anyone had experienced this.

As I have a stainless steel sink would anyone know whether this would make bib taps with upstands completely unsuitable?
Or whether having 'rigid tails' and a copper rather than a flexible pipe might mean I could have bib taps after all?
And, as you suggested John, supporting the taps from under the sink by using some thick plywood.....?

 

[Burnerman]

Can you give us a link to your taps of choice, please?
John