Extension DIY wire

[sellarphone]

Hi all, new here, so here goes:

Just had a 2 storey side extension built (shell only), and now i intend to finish it myself completley.

With regard to the electrics, i was under the impression that i could notify build control that i was going to do this, and they would appoint me an inspector, and check it all over?

i just called them, got myself a stroppy "well we will need to appoint someone to inspect, and that might cost you approx £300, if i were you i would get an electrician in", "we have never done this before"

Am i correct, that they have to let me do it, and they have to inspect it, at their cost?

I am very happy i can do this of the required standard, and i can read, so why the heck should i bend to BC (who have already had a pile of money), for basically telling me what i know (or can find out before i go ahead)

thoughts anyone?

 

[pjcomp]

I think they're duty bound to provide an inspector, but it will be at your cost, not theirs. Presumably you needed planning and building regs approval for the extension - if you had specified in the BR application that you would want electrical inspection as well as bricks and mortar you would probably have been charged accordingly.

PJ

 

[sellarphone]

the application states that all work to be carried out by a NICEIC certified contractor - but it also states lots of other things that we have changed along the build, and BC have been quite happy with that.

Is £300 inspection fee resonable in your opinion?

Makes me angry, cant do anything for yourself nowadays, even if you are fully capable. - I dont want to upset any pros here, but some of the standards of work you see from so called "pros" are shocking, and i would be loathed to let these people into my house. (having said that i do know there are plently of good uns too )

 

[riveralt]

Hi all, new here, so here goes:

Just had a 2 storey side extension built (shell only), and now i intend to finish it myself completley.

With regard to the electrics, i was under the impression that i could notify build control that i was going to do this, and they would appoint me an inspector, and check it all over?

i just called them, got myself a stroppy "well we will need to appoint someone to inspect, and that might cost you approx £300, if i were you i would get an electrician in", "we have never done this before"

Am i correct, that they have to let me do it, and they have to inspect it, at their cost?

I am very happy i can do this of the required standard, and i can read, so why the heck should i bend to BC (who have already had a pile of money), for basically telling me what i know (or can find out before i go ahead)

thoughts anyone?

There are set fees for BC notice, but this should have been picked up when you got planning permission - when you applied you did highlight the fact that you would be doing the electrical work didn't you?

Whether or not you apply for a BC notice is entirely up to you - if you do not then you will be breaking the law. The fact you have had a conversation with your BC may however have let the cat out of the basket.

You say you can read etc but have you ever designed an electrical circuit? Do you understand what will be involved or the consequences of altering/adding to the current electrical circuits?

I have dealt with many BC officers and this is the first time I have heard of one getting 'stroppy' - perhaps you need ring back and ask to speak to a supervisor or was it because you were refusing to pay anymore to the BC that caused things to go wrong. BC are normally very good at their job and are able to help, up to a point, DIYers - strange how you got a bad un...

 

[Wontdothatagain]

Building control are allowed to charge you "reasonable" costs to ensure that the instalation meets the required regs and that would require there electrician visting site about 3-4 times, 1st fix, 2nd fix, post 2nd fix and to inspect and test. You will be required to explain how your instalation will meet the Part P requirments.

Another way is to find an electrician that will allow you to carry out the work under there supervision and then notify the job after they have tested and comisioned the instalation.

 

[chappers]

here in oxford there is a set fee set out in the application form, and it is £600 per installation.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

when you applied you did highlight the fact that you would be doing the electrical work didn't you?

No:

the application states that all work to be carried out by a NICEIC certified contractor

Basically he told Building Control that he'd be using a NICEIC certified contractor to do the electrical work, and his application was approved on that basis.

Now he wants to change something and they want to change their charges. Seems reasonable.

Where the local authority consider it necessary to engage and incur the costs of a consultant to provide specialist advice or services in relation to a particular aspect of building work those costs shall also be included in the determination referred to in paragraph (1).

If he wanted to do the electrics himself he shouldn't have told them that a NICEIC certified contractor would be doing them

 

[ban-all-sheds]

the application states that all work to be carried out by a NICEIC certified contractor - but it also states lots of other things that we have changed along the build, and BC have been quite happy with that.

Would any of the other things you've changed have made a difference to the way they worked out their fee?

 

[Trog]

Building control are allowed to charge you "reasonable" costs to ensure that the instalation meets the required regs and that would require there electrician visting site about 3-4 times, 1st fix, 2nd fix, post 2nd fix and to inspect and test. You will be required to explain how your instalation will meet the Part P requirments.

Another way is to find an electrician that will allow you to carry out the work under there supervision and then notify the job after they have tested and comisioned the instalation.

Both times I did this the Building Control Officer did the first fix inspection and they then had an electrician come round once to do the inspect and test at the end.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

That was before then, this is after now.

As they say.

Now, because of The Building (Local Authority Charges) Regulations 2010, LABCs have to pass on the costs of buying in external advice and services. The last sentence in 1.26 of Approved Document P is now null and void.

Those regulations did not come into force until 1st April 2010, so if the OP put his application before then he could argue that they don't apply to the charges he should pay. But then the LABC would, I am perfectly sure, just say "you said you'd have a registered contractor do the electrical work, not yourself, so you are going to have to do what you said you would do."

When it comes to filling in official forms, caveat scriptor, as they also say...

 

[Buzx1313]

Hi all, new here, so here goes:

Just had a 2 storey side extension built (shell only), and now i intend to finish it myself completley.

With regard to the electrics, i was under the impression that i could notify build control that i was going to do this, and they would appoint me an inspector, and check it all over?

i just called them, got myself a stroppy "well we will need to appoint someone to inspect, and that might cost you approx £300, if i were you i would get an electrician in", "we have never done this before"

Am i correct, that they have to let me do it, and they have to inspect it, at their cost?

I am very happy i can do this of the required standard, and i can read, so why the heck should i bend to BC (who have already had a pile of money), for basically telling me what i know (or can find out before i go ahead)

thoughts anyone?

well sorry mate you should have had a qualified electrician do the job then..

i suppose all your cables are run in the zones,, all calculations for spacing factors done,, clacs for insulation done so you can size the cables correctly,, all testing done and a certificate produced to confirm this is correct,, registed for part p.. all done in accordance with the 17th edition regulations

i have no sympathy with you ..sorry ...get a tradesman in next time..

 

[ban-all-sheds]

There's no reason why he shouldn't DIY the electrics, provided he knows things like how to decide what cable and protective device to use for a given load, how the way that cables are installed affects how much current they can carry, where to run cables concealed in walls and partitions, under floors and outdoors, which circuits can be ring finals and which cannot, and what the advantages and disadvantages of each are, what the two main lighting circuit topologies are, and what the advantages and disadvantages of each are, what the 3 different types of domestic single-phase supplies provided in this country are and what differences each make to the requirements for the rest of the installation, particularly any outdoor supplies, how to identify extraneous conductive parts, and know the requirements for main and supplementary bonding of them, which circuits should be RCD protected and how to test the installation - what tests, in what sequence and at what point the installation would be energised.

But if he was going to do that it was stupid to tell the council on his application for Building Regulations approval that he was going to employ a registered electrician....

 

[tonyelectric]

OP, You are right in saying that they can't stop you doing the work, however you have to pay for the inspections and certification, and its up to them what this costs.

As BAS says there is an awful lot you need to know to do electrics properly, which is why we all did two years formal training and many years of on the job experience. And every spark on here will be able to tell stories of shoddy DIY jobs we've seen, BC know this and that they will have to advise and check what you do, so they charge for the privilage.

You dug a hole saying about using an NICEIC member, this tied you to a promise, you should have just said Part P Registered if you planned to use a contractor - imagine if your town had 4 ECA, 2 NAPIT, 1 Elecsa and only one NICEIC, you would be stuck wit their quote!!

 

[bernardgreen]

i was under the impression that i could notify build control that i was going to do this, and they would appoint me an inspector, and check it all over?

That is ( as told to me by a building inspector ) how the the system is designed to work.

For other work ( timbering etc ) the contractor or architect provides the BCO plans with calculations of load bearing etc etc which are checked on the BCO desk and if necessary sent back for re-calculating. Then during construction the BCO will isnspect the work to ensure the work done matches the plans and sizes as calculated. Where the BCO has trust in the contractor and work force sometimes the inspections are not done to the same level as they are when the contractor has a record of cost cutting.

For electrical work the same system was envisaged but not many BC offices had staff capable of checking a design of an electrical installation and so they asked for the Part P system to allow them to charge for the hire of "qualified" electricans to check the calculations and the work done if the contractor could not do those designs themselves.

As the BCO told me if a DIY person provides us with clear legible calculations for the installation that we can simply check with the relevent standard and can convince us that (s)he will carry out the work in strict compliance with the plans we approve then we may be able to charge only a nominal fee for the paper work.

He also said that some of the "registered fo Part P" electricians cause him headaches as not all are as scrupulous in the work on someone else's house as a sensible and properly informed DIY person working to improve and maintain his own property in a safe state.

Note.... Not all BCOs have that amount of discretion allowed to them, I said sensible and properly informed DIY person and it is only some electricians that cause headaches for the BCO who was talking to me.

 

[securespark]

this is the first time I have heard of one getting 'stroppy'

See here...

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