Fighting over SECOND FIX definition!!

[gemmabuild]

Hi - having a bit of quibble with builder over extension where contract says "In essence, all works required to second fix to make the new build habitable"

He's refusing to fit skirting and architrave - saying it's decoration. But I would consider skirting and architrave as second fix.

Does anyone know where I can find an official definition/explanation of second fix I can refer to and get him to do the work.

THANK YOU VERY VERY MUCH!!! really need help on this one...seems a bit unfair.

 

[maltaron]

Whether or not there is a definition, I have been a carpenter & joiner all my working life and second fix has allways been : Hang doors and fit all locks and door furniture; fix skirtings and architraves and any quadrants or other beading where necessary; punch in all nails ready for decorators. Decorators to at minimum Knot, stop and prime.

 

[theoldun]

First fix and second fix
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search
First fix and second fix are terms used in the UK housebuilding and commercial building construction industry.
First fix comprises all the work needed to take a building from foundation to putting plaster on the internal walls. This includes constructing walls, floors and ceilings, and inserting cables for electrical supply and pipes for water supply.
Second fix comprises all the work after the plastering to a finished house. Electrical fixtures are connected to the cables, sinks and baths connected to the pipes, and doors fitted into doorframes. Second fix work requires a neater finish than first fix.
The division of work is a convenient description because electricians, plumbers and carpenters will probably have to make two separate visits to one property under construction, at separate times. Project managers can report "first fix complete" or "second fix 50% done" and others can understand.
Some construction companies specialise in first fix work or second fix work, but most do both

This is the nearest definition of 2nd fix that you will get, Skirts and archs are definitely included in 2nd fix carpenter and not painter. Door locks and latches are included in 2nd fix, but door furniture comes under finals.
Regards oldun. Will post for you tomorrow ref squeaky floors.

 

[tony1851]

Yes, go with the others; your builder is definitely trying it on.
Skirting boards and architraves are not decorative items but serve a functional purpose. Skirtings protect the fragile plasterwork at the base of the walls; architraves cover the inevitable gap between the door frame and wall/plaster.

Decorators do not do this work.

 

[^woody^]

I don't think that there is any official/legal definition of "second fix". There may be something in caselaw precedent, but nothing comes to mind.

Normally in cases like this, it would fall back to the concept of "custom and practice". In which case all non structural internal timber work is "second fix". Generally, if its planed, smooth timber, and something that would normally be painted or stained, then it's second fix.

It's certainly not decoration - which implies something that would be regularly changed or updated

What you could say to your builder is that you will jointly go to one or more independent professionals for an opinion (say, an RICS member) and be bound by the consensus. And with the understanding that the person who was wrong pay all the fees.

However, I would have concerns about your contract clause. "In essence, all works required to second fix to make the new build habitable" says to me that the property only has to be habitable ... ie you can occupy the property perfectly well without skirting and architraves. Some properties do not even have any

Further, "to second fix" is very vague .... is that up to second fix (ie before) or after?

There is potential for different interpretation of that clause, but its badly worded. I'd not like to rely on that clause

I would go down the route of referring this to a professional for an opinion, and infer that while you are at it you might just get that person to inspect the whole work to see if it is up to all relevant standards

Either way, do not pay for the work until this is sorted out. In contract terms, you have a dispute and you are entitled to withhold "reasonable payment" and involve someone to mediate or decide the disputed items. Don't be intimidated by anything the builder says, and bear in mind that he must still adhere to his other contractual obligations