Flueless gas fires

[diyisfree]

I have seen a very nice hang on the wall flue less gas fire (one that looks like a plasma screen) and the wife has fallen in love with it. "I have to have this fire" she said

My question is, although these are flueless and have a catalyst built in to burn away any harmful carbon monoxide and so on, do they need additional ventilation or air bricks ?

What i mean is i understand that gas fires burn the oxygen from the room so does that mean we need to vent the room to provide more air ? The room is quite large measuring about 26 feet by 16 so it isn't the smallest.

don't worry i wouldn't even attemt to fit a gass fire even though its flueless, I just don't want to buy it to find out i then have to spoil all my newly decorated house in order to use it

I have posted a link to the site where it is advertised in case you need more details to comment.

http://www.inspiredfires.co.uk/store/products/scandium.asp

I trust im not breaking any rules by doing that ???

 

[doitall]

Thats an expensive way to kill yourself, much cheaper to put your head in the oven.

The Association of Registered Gas Installers, have issued advice to their members, Not to install or service flueless gas fires.

They are dangerous, and are banned in many Countries including most of the USA.

 

[Blasphemous]

Ask ANY Gas Fitter on here if he/she would have one in their house. I would bet the answer will be around 100% saying NO!

To answer your question however, YES it will need ventilation. Corgi give us guidelines on ventilation requirements but you would need to consult the Manufacturers Instructions to certain their size requirements.

 

[Alfredo]

Most seem to require a permanent 100cm vent..which will let in a hell of a draught..so people will block them. I spend a considerable amount of my time unblocking vital airvents blocked by tenants, so don't tell me it won't happen cos it will.

Flueless gas fires are just a VERY BAD IDEA. In fact I just shake my head in disbelief that all the organisations that crow about gas safety seem to have accepted them with a wimper.

The move away from open flues to balanced and fanned flues has contributed a great deal to the improved safety of gas appliances. Yes there are still accidents, but they are many fewer and many of us thought that ultimately the open flued appliance would become illegal to fit one day. The emergence of flueless catalytic devices seems to have rudely put the process into reverse. I would not fit one in my house or anybody elses house.

Alfredo

 

[Gasguru]

Despite the intentions of those at the top we're going backwards in gas safety.

To cut installation costs manufacturers have been allowed to sell flueless gas fires in this country.

Pre-mix (generally Band A) boilers are a big backward step in terms of gas safety just for the sake of a little more preceived efficiency. Several design features make these boilers far more likely to cause gas incidents than those preceding.

Coupled with the ever tightening of rules and regulations (and their added cost) has also contributed to a massive increase in illegal (and generally) sub-standard work.

 

[Paul Barker]

Thats an expensive way to kill yourself, much cheaper to put your head in the oven.

That would only work if you lit it when the stoichiometric mixture is reached. You could sit there all day waiting for it to kill you in any other way, but you would get a headache and might be sick, and would need a chiropracter for the neck.

Would I have a Flueless gas fire at home? I wouldn't even have an open flued gas appliance of any type and I don't have a gas hob or oven either.

 

[diyisfree]

BWOODY HELL

Ok guy's enough said I feel kind of embarassed now... So if they are so bad why do companies sell then so openly without any mention of the fact that several countries have banned them..

Cant wait to show the missus what you guys have said. This is going to save me a fortune

 

[chrishutt]

... So if they are so bad why do companies sell then so openly without any mention of the fact that several countries have banned them..

I don't think any countries have banned them, as such. Almost every state in the US has approved their use, one exception being California, and they have not yet been approved in Canada (not quite the same as banning them). In the European Union they have been accepted under the Gas Appliances Directive, following tests by Nominated Bodies, so there is nothing much the HSE or Corgi can do about it.

 

[ollski]

As far as I'm aware BRITISH GAS have been the only national company who always have, and still do, refuse to install, repair or service them.

They are definitely fast losing favour across the board though. There used to be debates on here about the merits of them even a year or so ago, but I think you will now find a unanimous dislike.

This is before the catalytic converters start reaching the end of their working lives aswell....god knows what will happen then.

 

[newcomers]

So what would you guys do if you came across one as part of a landlords certficate??.....find any excuse to close it down? (Im not being sarcastic by the way, thats a genuine question)

 

[Alfredo]

Landlords cert. Simple. You test it as required and if it is operating safely at the time of your visit, you say so and pass it. If not you cut it off.

I use the faults and rectification section to cover myself. If i find a flueless LPG heater in a property i write down that i recommend it is not used in the property without a window open in the same room. For a flueless fire I would write something to the effect that there is an increased risk with these appliances in view of the lack of flue, but that the appliance was operating satisfactorily at the time of your inspection.

What more can you do .

Alfredo

 

[diyisfree]

I thought they were a relativly new thing ? I have to admit though that i have only recently been looking around for something modern.

Paul, with regards the remark about instaling a gas fire to an open flu? I used to have a fire fronted back boiler ( Now removed) is that what you refer to as an "open flue"

am i better scraping the hole idea and get some type of electric fire instead ?

 

[sm1thson]

Paul, with regards the remark about instaling a gas fire to an open flu? I used to have a fire fronted back boiler ( Now removed) is that what you refer to as an "open flue"

i think so but Im not a gas type person, here are the definitions for you to read untill some one comes along and confirms.

 

[Paul Barker]

Open flue is where the appliance draws air for combustion from the room but the exhaust goes outside except when it is spilling, and all spill at some time or another.

Balanced flue is where the inlet and exhaust are proximal to outside, so that they are in the same pressure zone and wind conditions affect them equally.

Room sealed, all balanced flues are room sealed but some room sealed devices have two pipes that are not balanced onbe with the other, however they both terminate outside.

I would only have a room sealed gas appliance.

 

[diyisfree]

Umm looks like an electric fire then