how to price/quote for p&d jobs - support for a newbie p

[spaghetti77]

Hi all

After working on and off with an experienced painter and decorator for the past year (and 3 years of scenic construction painting for tv and theatre) plus 3 house refurbs I am now looking for work on my own as a painter and decorator. I am too old and can't afford quals but feel confident in my standard of finish in decorating - happy customers so far.

This week I have done some quotes but I wondering if I am undercharging for them. One reason I am giving a low price is because my pace of work is slow. People who I have done work for before for have not minded this, they get a really good result - but I am so concious of it. I have mentioned to when quoting that I am not fast and allow for contingency in my estimated times it will take to finish a job. I also add that I want to give a great finish (which I do, I want to a good reputation for that).

Here are some prices I have given this week:

average bugalow living room, strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper - £260 estimated 5 days

2 x bugalow double bedrooms, strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper - £480 allow 2 weeks

bugalow hall, incl 5 doors plus a double living room strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper = £620

Am I way way off here in costs and time it take to do a job? I am working on my own. I tell myself as I am just starting out I will be slow and once I am quicker and more established that is when I can earn money.

Your feedback/experience would be greatly appreciated. Maybe you were slow at first? No nasties please!

 

[D_Hailsham]

Are those prices labour only, or do they include materials?

 

[Harbourwoodwork]

If your standards are high and can do murals and paint effects go up market and charge more ,try architects and interior designers not many can do the real thing.

 

[spaghetti77]

Are those prices labour only, or do they include materials?

Labour only

 

[spaghetti77]

If your standards are high and can do murals and paint effects go up market and charge more ,try architects and interior designers not many can do the real thing.

I have not done murals in houses nor paint effects but I have done similar for stage, what I plan to do - presuming it is quiet at or after xmas - is to create a kids bedroom portfolio of murals for boys&girls bedrooms. I would have no idea what to charge though!

 

[flameport]

I don't do decorating, so no idea on how long those jobs should take.

However, £480 for 2 weeks work is ridiculously low, same goes for £260 for 5 days. That's just £50 per day, out of which you have to pay for expenses such as travelling to the site, tools, insurance etc.

Even ignoring all of those costs, £50 for a days work is barely minimum wage.

 

[spaghetti77]

I don't do decorating, so no idea on how long those jobs should take.

However, £480 for 2 weeks work is ridiculously low, same goes for £260 for 5 days. That's just £50 per day, out of which you have to pay for expenses such as travelling to the site, tools, insurance etc.

Even ignoring all of those costs, £50 for a days work is barely minimum wage.

I know you are right. Do you think people will be happy to pay more even if
I take maybe 50% longer than a time served pro?

I am pricing by the job for the very reason I am slow. I kind of see it as I start out I will start being slow (like with most new jobs) and will not earn a good wage 'til I am fast and good... I'm all ears if people think this is the wrong attitude - of course I want money! But I want to be fair.

 

[gregers]

er what about tax/insurance and public liability insurance etc etc,all comming out of your bulls eye per day.
imo youve got to be looking at minimum of £400 p/week.

 

[Johnmelad]

You need to sit down and work out all of your current income and all your outgoings, don't forget things like:

Rent, Insurances, bank fees, overdraft costs, household maintenance, garden maintenance, cleaning products, home phone, mobile, Internet, TV licence; pet insurance, gas & plumbing insurance, food, smokes drinks out, snacks, breakdown cover car maint, parking fees, loan repayments, credit card repayments, clothing work and other, cost of nappies, pocket money, school trips pet food, Christmas, hobbies, days out, books, cinema trips, satellite TV subscriptions, odds and sods, other big one offs + the more obvious... etc, etc, etc.

If you let me have your Email address (if you have Excel) I will send you a comprehensive budget calculator.

Every-one's income needs will be different. A single mans needs will be different to a married mans, living at home different from living away from home.

The lists are endless.

John

 

[HERTS P&D]

At those prices you will never be out of work , but you will be living on the bread line.

And as for a quite time - normally between now and running up to xmas you will find that you will be very busy. People want their houses done before relatives come round for the turkey!

Andy

 

[spaghetti77]

Just to fill you in a bit more I am at home with my mum at the mo (after a relationship breakdown a year ago) so my outgoings aren't that much. No kids. I am living here whilst I build up my business (that's the plan) and then hoping to move out asap.

But you are all pointing out really good and obvious things oops like ALL the expenses, which will all really help me. So thank you thank you! I haven't earnt much money this year and living at home I have kind of lost sight of all day to day living expenses that will come once I move out. p.s I am working insured btw!

It may sound strange but I've grown up not having a lot of money and find it hard to get my head around quoting for large amounts of money that I and I guess the circle of people I have grown up around - have never had enough money to call in traders for painting & decorating. Plumbing emergencies, yes. Joiners no.

The sticking point for me is that I think I can't work fast enough yet to actually be able to bring in what I need. For example, the same job will take another decorator 3 days and £300 which could take me up to 5 days. Another decorator may be able to start a second job on the 4 th day, at the mo I can't.

The guy I have been working on and off with throughout the year has moved abroad, we never talked about quotes and costs. I just turned up, did what I could and got paid (not a lot you won't be surprised to hear!). I have since tried to talk to 3 other decorators who I don't know very well and they just don't wont to talk to me! They don't know anything about me - they are in my boyfriend's cycling club. Did I say I was female- not that I think it matters getting work, but I could really do with knowing how much other people charge for painting and decorating... I'm busy working now for the next 3 weeksso can'tinvite people round to do a quote at my mum's, is there any other way of finding out? I hoped I might get some anwers on here. I've got email a quote this morning and I am tempted to up my prices.

What would you expect to pay for this job & how long would you expect it to take?

Emulsion bedroom walls (double sized bedroom), change of colour from pink to aqua, ceiling NOT being painted, window, skirting boards and door glossed = there are 2 rooms to do exactly the same.

 

[chapeau]

£50 per day is a good deal if you are as good as you say. I pay a lad what works out to be £80 per day cash. I'm happy, he's happy, and he's a decent joiner too so does all the woodwork for same price. However the economy is stuffed so the only way rates are going is down and only you know what is competitive in your area.

 

[spaghetti77]

You need to sit down and work out all of your current income and all your outgoings, don't forget things like:

Rent, Insurances, bank fees, overdraft costs, household maintenance, garden maintenance, cleaning products, home phone, mobile, Internet, TV licence; pet insurance, gas & plumbing insurance, food, smokes drinks out, snacks, breakdown cover car maint, parking fees, loan repayments, credit card repayments, clothing work and other, cost of nappies, pocket money, school trips pet food, Christmas, hobbies, days out, books, cinema trips, satellite TV subscriptions, odds and sods, other big one offs + the more obvious... etc, etc, etc.

If you let me have your Email address (if you have Excel) I will send you a comprehensive budget calculator.

Every-one's income needs will be different. A single mans needs will be different to a married mans, living at home different from living away from home.

The lists are endless.

John

Thanks Johnnthat would be great to have a copy of your spreadsheet - I haven't figured out how to pm people on here - how can I get you my email address?

 

[HERTS P&D]

Female decorator! That can only help.

You will find that most of your work will be from domestic customers, that's what you want anyway as you can charge more money.

Do you have a van? If so you could park it in b&q car park just outside the exit from the shop doors with a sign saying "feme decorator- 7 days service - call 07---------."

This is a good way to get work but does mean you leaving your van in the car park on saturday and Sunday.

If possible have a van that is pink and stands out like a sore thumb.

Just few ideas

Andy

 

[CheshireDecorators]

Hi all

After working on and off with an experienced painter and decorator for the past year (and 3 years of scenic construction painting for tv and theatre) plus 3 house refurbs I am now looking for work on my own as a painter and decorator. I am too old and can't afford quals but feel confident in my standard of finish in decorating - happy customers so far.

This week I have done some quotes but I wondering if I am undercharging for them. One reason I am giving a low price is because my pace of work is slow. People who I have done work for before for have not minded this, they get a really good result - but I am so concious of it. I have mentioned to when quoting that I am not fast and allow for contingency in my estimated times it will take to finish a job. I also add that I want to give a great finish (which I do, I want to a good reputation for that).

Here are some prices I have given this week:

average bugalow living room, strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper - £260 estimated 5 days

2 x bugalow double bedrooms, strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper - £480 allow 2 weeks

bugalow hall, incl 5 doors plus a double living room strip, prep walls and woodwork, 1 x under coat, 2 x gloss, paint ceiling, hang wallpaper = £620

Am I way way off here in costs and time it take to do a job? I am working on my own. I tell myself as I am just starting out I will be slow and once I am quicker and more established that is when I can earn money.

Your feedback/experience would be greatly appreciated. Maybe you were slow at first? No nasties please!

Hi there. Your price is far to little, bungalow living room ..

Strip 1day
Prep walls/wood size walls paint ceiling x2 1day
Line walls 1day
Woodwork all waterbased products 1day
Finish paper 1 or 2 days depending on paper

Now with the above there's plenty of time for example prob wouldent take you all day to compleate woodwork but allow for it just incase something else takes longer an so on.

Id price 6days if I was you. £850 - 1,200 is what you should be looking at.