Neighbours new extension (and attaching it to ours)

[kp7722]

Hi all,

We have a two storey extension at the back of our house that's been there for 30 or so years. The next door neighbour wants to build a single storey extension. I've just spoken to their builder and he's explained that they plan to use our existing exterior wall as their exterior wall and attach it to ours by using wall ties.

Should I be concerned about anything? For example:

- will this put any extra load on our wall/foundations? If so, what do I do about this?
- is this standard practice? (I presume it is for terraced housing)
- do I need to go down any legal route so that I'm covered if they damage our extension in any way? Do I need to get contracts drawn up for anything?
- does the council need to be informed?

I have no idea about any of this so any help will be gratefully appreciated. I may be just blowing this completely out of proportion of course.

Paul.

 

[joe-90]

Google Party Wall Act.

 

[tony1851]

As it's your wall, they have no right to fix anything to it. If they did, and you left it at that, it would become effectively a party wall.
In your own interests, get them to build a separate wall on their side, even though they will thereby loose a little width.

 

[kp7722]

Thanks for your replies.

I think the issue comes down to money. If they tie into our existing wall they can afford to have the extension built, otherwise I think it's a no-go for them. I also don't want to get into a dispute over it as I can't be doing with any hostility over this (we see them in passing on a regular basis).

If we agree to this (in writing), what can we do to cover our backs, etc?

 

[TheVictorian]

Bear in mind that them saving money could mean that you are losing money if it devalues your house. Say no.

 

[joe-90]

Plus, the thicker their walls, the more sound insulation you get.

 

[kp7722]

I was hoping that somebody was going to tell me not to be so stupid and just let them do it, making my life easier. Thanks all for your honest answers.

When our extension was built our man-hole cover was sealed and permission was given to allow us access to our sewerage pipe from the neighbour's property. The builder is saying that this is naughty and means that a little more work is needed from him in order to maintain that access from their property to ours. I presume regulations have changed in the last 30 years as I've dug the plans out of our extension and it details exactly that. I think they're trying to use this as the bargaining chip for attaching to our wall. I think they're also grasping at straws by saying that it will benefit us by making our extension warmer.

 

[tony1851]

Another issue you need to be careful with is the formation of a cavity tray.
If any rainwater penetrates the outer skin of your wall, it will not be a problem for you. However, if the neighbour uses your wall, any penetrating rainwater would show up on their side of the wall. Because of this, building inspectors usually insist on a cavity tray being inserted in the wall, above the level of the new roof. This can be difficult to do properly, and will be disruptive to your wall.
If the cost of the wall is an issue for them, it's likely that they are trying to get the job done on the cheap (the extra wall would not be that big a cost relative to the whole job). A cheap job can mean cowboy builders.
You obviously wish to keep on good terms, but in the long term this situation can cause problems. Advise them of the penetrating damp issue and see if that makes them think again.

 

[joinerjohn]

Hmmmm, I'm assuming your neighbour has applied for (and got) planning permission? If not, I'd be very wary of allowing them to build off your wall. Should planning permission be refused, they can't build. If they build without PP, then apply for retrospective PP and it's refused, they would have to pull down what they have built (not good if they've used your wall)

 

[Hugh Jaleak]

You need to read this and understand your rights! http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_partywall_explain_booklet.pdf

You have the right under the PWA to an independant surveyor of your choosing (at your neighbours expense) to oversee the works and look after your interests. I would not allow the neighbour to do anything until you have a surveyor appointed to look after your interests.

If the manhole cover is still accessible in your property, provided it is fitted with a screwed down, sealed cover then that is perfectly acceptable practice, even if it's not an ideal situation. It seems the builder may be trying to wear you down to make his life easier, dont fall for it.

 

[tony1851]

You need to read this and understand your rights! http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_partywall_explain_booklet.pdf

You have the right under the PWA to an independant surveyor of your choosing (at your neighbours expense) to oversee the works and look after your interests. I would not allow the neighbour to do anything until you have a surveyor appointed to look after your interests.

.

The point about this, though, is that it's not a party wall - it's the OPs wall.
But, he can of course insist on the procedure of the PWA because his neighbour will be excavating within 3m of the OPs structure.

 

[^woody^]

The PWA wont apply unless the wall is on the boundary. If it is, then it may be possible for the neighbour to use the wall subject to serving a notice. If it's not then he can't use it without express permission.

In practical terms there is nothing wrong with the neighbour using it. There is already a shared party wall between the houses, so this wont make a bit of difference if this becomes a shared wall too, and there will not be any devaluation either.

I can't see it being a cost issue. The cost will be insignificant in context of the rest of the build. Are you sure its not the builder's suggestion to the neighbour?

If there is separation, then what happens to the gap? There could be some issues with damp because of keeping a small gap between the walls. It depends on the detail

It comes down to a "what's in it for me" decision. There are no advantages for allowing it, but no significant disadvantages either. On the other hand there are advantages for the neighbour. Would it be reasonable to share that advantage in terms of him paying you to use the wall?

 

[tony1851]

The PWA wont apply unless the wall is on the boundary

It might if the footings of the neighbour's extension will be below the OPs footings.

 

[^woody^]

The PWA wont apply unless the wall is on the boundary

It might if the footings of the neighbour's extension will be below the OPs footings.

Which is unlikely next to a two story extension

Anyway, the only reason the neighbour would invoke the PWA is if it would give him the right to use the wall. There is no reason for him to use it otherwise.

And if he does plan on using the wall, he wont be putting in any footings there, but will build a stud wall off the slab - that is, if he has any sense

 

[tony1851]

The PWA wont apply unless the wall is on the boundary

It might if the footings of the neighbour's extension will be below the OPs footings.

Which is unlikely next to a two story extension

Anyway, the only reason the neighbour would invoke the PWA is if it would give him the right to use the wall.

But the PWA does not define what is and what isn't a party wall. It merely gives certain rights if an adjoining neighbour wants to do work on the wall if it is accepted as a party wall.

I think in this case, as the OP's wall has been up 30 years, and belongs to his house, the wall would NOT be regarded as a party wall but would be owned solely by the OP.