Non notifiable electrics during notifiable job

[John D v2.0]

We are doing an extension and notified and submitted full plans to building control.
They have approved but one of the conditions is we have to provide a "part p electrical installation certificate"

I have just replied stating that there are no new circuits and none of the work is in a special location therefore part p doesn't require following a procedure for certification.

My concern is that in section 3 of the part p AD it does say the changes should be designed, tested and certificated in accordance with bs7671, and they can serve an enforcement notice for "unsafe and non compliant work"

So can they charge extra to get it all checked out by someone on their list, or should I just test it myself and let them retest at their cost if they want? I'm happy to demonstrate that the work is correct, I just don't want to pay any more than I already have for building regs paperwork.

 

[EFLImpudence]

All work should be accompanied by the relevant certificates whether notifiable or not

In this case with an extension you have notified it. An Electrical Installation Certificate will be required.
There is no such thing as a Part P certificate.

Everything should be designed tested and certificated properly.
If they do not deem you skilled to do the work and accept your certificates then they will demand to inspect it during and after and, of course, they don't do it for nothing as that would mean all of us are paying.

 

[securespark]

I've done some non-notifiable work and lost the certs.

I don't have any test gear anymore either...

 

[ericmark]

I had a fight to get the LABC inspector to accept my installation certificate. To start with my son was going to do inspecting and testing as he still had valid insurance. However the LABC inspector was unwilling to allow him to test and inspect even with a C&G 2391. So my son was saying he would need some one with qualifications which exceeded his to be able to counter what my son said was A1, it would otherwise be a pointless argument as to if it passed or failed, and no one other than the installer could make out the installation certificate anyway.

We were getting no where, so my son said what if my dad does the inspecting and testing he has a degree in electrics? at this the LABC inspector backed down, clearly anyone who claimed the installation was not up to scratch would need qualifications above mine to counter what I said was good enough, he was unlikely to find anyone.

The certificate was made out and given to council who then sent the completion certificate in the post.

After this I was told the council rarely allowed anyone to test their own work. Seems they did not have the expertise to say if the installation was OK or not, so they wanted some one else to carry the can. They would try all they could to get one to employ some one else to inspect and test.

With an installation not requiring notification you would only require a minor works certificate anyway, and there is very little on the manor works which requires test equipment, remember inquiry is a valid method, so to get the ELI one only has to ring the DNO and measure the resistance of the cable, you don't need a loop impedance tester.

The one thing you can't test is the RCD, can't measure the time of 40 mS with a stop watch. However if you already have a certificate then there is nothing to stop you copying the results of the old certificate, that is inquiry.

So in real terms assuming you have the old certificates it would be near impossible to work out if you have measured or copied, we know it is 18 mV/A/meter with 2.5mm² cable so you can calculate the results without ever using a meter.

You will remember when you helped me develop software to work out volt drop, the error with a meter resulted in it being near impossible to show the readings were out of spec. So it is also near enough impossible for the LABC to show the guessed reading you enter are guesses rather than actually taken. Only thing they could do is ask for calibration certificates for the meters, which is unlikely. If you can't guess it no one can.

So write out a minor works, give it to them, and see how it goes. Make out that you borrowed meters, a one off favour from old friend in the trade, and once presented it is unlikely they will object.

 

[John D v2.0]

Thanks Eric Mark that's useful input.
Having said that I'm not sure enquiry is a valid method for testing, but it is valid for design, the reason you have to test continuity and IR is to make sure the values are what you expected ie there wasn't an installation error implementing the design.
Anyway that's a moot point here as I have the proper testers and know how to use them.
I'll see what they say about part p - I do need to comply even for non notifiable work, but there's no prescribed procedure, so it could well be down to the inspector's discretion.

 

[John D v2.0]

Thanks efli, I'll see what they deem in the end but I think you're right in that being the crucial issue. I'll be producing the right certificates anyway - for amendments to existing circuits, and they're welcome to a copy if it keeps them happy!