powering an usb audio interface without a pc or laptop....

[xelaris]

It just needs a host controller to take it out of a power saving state.

USB OTG with a phone will probably work fine.

that would be a neat solution...I always carry my smart-phone with me - it is similar in size to my usb battery pack, although I don't think it can provide the same "stamina"....for £1-2 for a OTG adapter it is well worth trying.

 

[Monkeh]

Well, no, your phone won't power it for long. But it should be able to get it to turn on.

 

[xelaris]

First of all....your idea that the Edirol needs a PC/laptop to "think" is wrong - I've plugged a "very dumb" Fostex MR8 which has a USB host port (to connect a CD writer) and the Edirol turned on and worked perfectly...(case closed).

Well I think this is the first time you mentioned the Fostex isn't it? If the EDIROL needed just power then it would have worked with the battery pack. USB only has 4 wires. Two for power and the two for data (TX/RX) so I'd say the case isn't closed at all.

Second point:
Some functions in certain electronic devices are deliberately hidden <snip> for better profits for the manufacturer <snip> this might also be seen as unethical as it produce lot of wastages. <snip>
Anyone who doesn't think so...is either too naive (sorry) - or is someone from the other side - i.e. someone who has some links and interests in not telling the rest of us the truth....(case closed)

You seem to have a bit of a problem with businesses making a profit?!? If they didn't make a profit then most wouldn't be in business for very long.

As for features being locked or disabled, yes that does go on. I'm also sure it contributes to profitability, or at least makes lines viable in an ever more competitive market. Its done to rationalise parts inventory; and to make manufacturing leaner to reduce cost and waste; and to make products at lower prices.

Danechip gave us an idea of why a simple battery pack doesn't work (a sort of hardware "handshake" is needed).
I suspect you are on the other side (are you?)....never mind - if I was on that side I'd probably would do the same and I wouldn't tell the truth cos' I'd be making less money - since I'm on the other side (consumer) I can afford to tell it as it is...
Anyhow this sort of things happens more or less in any trade. Still it is quite unnerving having to pay ££££ for field audio devices just because the adapter is AC/AC type or because of an "handshaking" strategy.
If I call Roland I expect the kind of: "whatddoyouwant"? you can't put batteries on that Edirol...but we can offer you a Boss BR800 at a special discount price...

 

[xelaris]

Well, no, your phone won't power it for long. But it should be able to get it to turn on.

well, I'll plug the OTG adaptor on the battery pack then...
Still, I've just seen some OTG adapters which take care of linking smartphone and battery pack:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/GaoHuiHong-...UTF8&qid=1377186903&sr=1-1&keywords=otg+power

all new stuff to me...

 

[Monkeh]

Still it is quite unnerving having to pay ££££ for field audio devices just because the adapter is AC/AC type or because of an "handshaking" strategy.

They use AC supplies for a reason, and the 'handshaking strategy' is not their doing nor a strategy.

well, I'll plug the OTG adaptor on the battery pack then...

It doesn't work that way, you need a host controller. That cable might work, though.

 

[xelaris]

Still it is quite unnerving having to pay ££££ for field audio devices just because the adapter is AC/AC type or because of an "handshaking" strategy.

They use AC supplies for a reason, and the 'handshaking strategy' is not their doing nor a strategy.

well, I'll plug the OTG adaptor on the battery pack then...

It doesn't work that way, you need a host controller. That cable might work, though.

"That cable adaptor" should link the battery pack (and juice) to the smartphone which in turn is going to pass the juice to the Edirol - that's what I've understood...not very efficient maybe but in theory it should work (I hope).

 

[xelaris]

missed that one about the "strategy"....
here's my hint:
Their strategy has nothing to do with leaving the handshake "lock" (that's debatable anyway)....their strategy is to leave the Edirol without any DC socket (that way it would be easily fed with external batteries) then they tell us all - look, no ugly wart on the wall is required (of course, no one like them). So, in a way it's a win win situation for them (lose lose for us) because that way they are saving a bit on components (no dc socket and more) and also they can push other live/batteries powered products with more "punch" (more effectively).
See now? (just don't go there....there are other nastiness about marketing strategies which are quite unpalatable for us commoners).

 

[Monkeh]

missed that one about the "strategy"....
here's my hint:
Their strategy has nothing to do with leaving the handshake "lock" (that's debatable anyway)....their strategy is to leave the Edirol without any DC socket (that way it would be easily fed with external batteries)

Or, perhaps, they couldn't design a unit which operates solely off DC power with the chips they'd picked if they wanted to be able to call it USB compliant?

Couldn't be anything technical like that, no.

 

[ChrisFrost]

I suspect you are on the other side (are you?)...

Nope. I was, but no longer.

Looking at this thread I guess you're one of those folk who always suspect a conspiracy... So meh, I'll waste no more time.

 

[xelaris]

I suspect you are on the other side (are you?)...

Nope. I was, but no longer.

Looking at this thread I guess you're one of those folk who always suspect a conspiracy... So meh, I'll waste no more time.

naah...just a little bit of controversy to spice things up really - beside, it goes against my own interests in making enemies from the other side
Lack of diplomacy, that's all - someone got 35 years in jail yesterday for being "too open"....I won't.

Bottom line?
They'll always find a way ahead of the game - we the consumers have some degree of choice but basically we'll be always catching up...

 

[xelaris]

missed that one about the "strategy"....
here's my hint:
Their strategy has nothing to do with leaving the handshake "lock" (that's debatable anyway)....their strategy is to leave the Edirol without any DC socket (that way it would be easily fed with external batteries)

Or, perhaps, they couldn't design a unit which operates solely off DC power with the chips they'd picked if they wanted to be able to call it USB compliant?

Couldn't be anything technical like that, no.

Some USB devices use both DC plug and USB type 2 - still these are USB compliant...
For a device like the Edirol it seem so weird they didn't thing of making it more palatable to e.g. buskers - it's small, light and very versatile - plug any type of microphone (even condenser type) mix the vocals/guitar or else with a playback track on the stereo line and send the mixed signal to a recorder (there is even a digital option). They can't be so dumb not to spot it - (of course, there are other battery powered devices for that).

 

[danechip]

missed that one about the "strategy"....
here's my hint:
Their strategy has nothing to do with leaving the handshake "lock" (that's debatable anyway)....their strategy is to leave the Edirol without any DC socket (that way it would be easily fed with external batteries)

Or, perhaps, they couldn't design a unit which operates solely off DC power with the chips they'd picked if they wanted to be able to call it USB compliant?

Couldn't be anything technical like that, no.

Some USB devices use both DC plug and USB type 2 - still these are USB compliant...
For a device like the Edirol it seem so weird they didn't thing of making it more palatable to e.g. buskers - it's small, light and very versatile - plug any type of microphone (even condenser type) mix the vocals/guitar or else with a playback track on the stereo line and send the mixed signal to a recorder (there is even a digital option). They can't be so dumb not to spot it - (of course, there are other battery powered devices for that).

Because some devices may require more current that the generic 500mA standard. Ever seen an external (2.5") portable hard drive with 2 USB plugs on one end to daisy chain for the extra 'power' ?

 

[xelaris]

missed that one about the "strategy"....
here's my hint:
Their strategy has nothing to do with leaving the handshake "lock" (that's debatable anyway)....their strategy is to leave the Edirol without any DC socket (that way it would be easily fed with external batteries)

Or, perhaps, they couldn't design a unit which operates solely off DC power with the chips they'd picked if they wanted to be able to call it USB compliant?

Couldn't be anything technical like that, no.

Some USB devices use both DC plug and USB type 2 - still these are USB compliant...
For a device like the Edirol it seem so weird they didn't thing of making it more palatable to e.g. buskers - it's small, light and very versatile - plug any type of microphone (even condenser type) mix the vocals/guitar or else with a playback track on the stereo line and send the mixed signal to a recorder (there is even a digital option). They can't be so dumb not to spot it - (of course, there are other battery powered devices for that).

Because some devices may require more current that the generic 500mA standard. Ever seen an external (2.5") portable hard drive with 2 USB plugs on one end to daisy chain for the extra 'power' ?

The Edirol isn't that energy demanding - unless one want to use a condenser mic which require 48v - note that the 48v switch is located on the bottom (not exactly hidden, but...) - like an extra feature which might be left alone most of the time....condenser microphones are generally more expensive and less rugged than dynamic (not recommended for busking) - all in all this makes for a perfect audio capture device for live recordings on the go...frustratingly, you can't pump any juice into it without a laptop!
Anyhow....there are at least 3 possible solutions:
1) A couple of those otg adapters which might not work on my Samsung i9000 - in that case I'll have to update my smartphone to another ROM or buy a newer Galaxy model...
2) the Raspberry PI is cheap and should work - but I'd rather avoid having to carry another small box around...
3) wait for the Roland/Edirol/Boss reply - (hold your breath).

As usual it's up to pioneers like myself to do all the hard work for all of ya out there....(call me a hero if you must - feeling an aureola over my head right now - hawwww)...if I fail we all fail and then we'll need £300 more to buy the Boss BR800 (so, wish me good luck please)....

 

[Monkeh]

As usual it's up to pioneers like myself to do all the hard work for all of ya out there....

You'd best get out the datasheets, regulations, specifications, and start designing these things yourself, if you want to be doing hard work.

 

[danechip]

As usual it's up to pioneers like myself to do all the hard work for all of ya out there....(call me a hero if you must - feeling an aureola over my head right now - hawwww)...if I fail we all fail and then we'll need £300 more to buy the Boss BR800 (so, wish me good luck please)....

No, It's not that at all. This is like complaining that your toothbrush does not reheat your dinner. If you want to 'pioneer' yourself a new design, then 'so be it'.

As we have ascertained, the £300 model does what you need, but unfortunately, you have a cheaper model that uses a PC to do the processing in real time. You would be spending a 'lot' of time redesigning this, when you could be busking or getting a job to buy the £300 model in the first place.