Time for a new boiler?

[mbaines1]

We currently have a Myson Apollo 80c which was installed in 1992, apart from a few issues over the years its been fine, serviced annually, our regular service engineer retired and at the last service his replacement said the boiler was obsolete and as few parts are available for it, and it needs replacing.

The boiler heats 8 rooms (2 of which have 2 radiators), and the DHW. The majority of the under floor pipework is from the original 1967 solid fuel boiler system, although all radiators were replaced with the boiler in 1992 (and system was chemically flushed at that time to clean the underfloor pipework before the new system was installed).

The property is a 1926 bungalow which is solid brick wall construction, is approximately 8m x 11.5m in size and rooms are approx. 2.5m high which calculators suggest a heat loss of approx 12.5KWh. There is a good 6" of insulation in the loft.

The total radiator "output" is 18.5KWh based on radiator specification - all radiators are Myson Supaline of various sizes - some double panels. The radiators still all look in good condition, and when we had the valves changed a couple of years ago had very little black sludge in them.

The heating system is open vented.

The original time based controller was replaced with an Evohome system a few years ago and has full control of all radiators (apart from bathroom currently).

I'm thinking the new boiler would be best as a heat only (direct replacement of current boiler) although engineer last time suggested converting to a combi as it would do away with the stored hot water. I'm not convinced about this, as we have an alternative heating source of hot water if boiler fails at the moment. (we also have solid fuel fires in 2 rooms if boiler fails)

The boiler is currently situated on an internal kitchen wall - and the flue goes out thru the ceiling and then up into the old solid fuel chimney - using a flue liner. From whats been said on these forums before I assume the new flue will have to go directly out through the roof.

The main problem I can foresee is how to get rid of the condensate, as there is no route from current boiler location to outside.

I assume there will be lots of regulation changes since the last install in 1992, so my query is what things should I be looking at when quotes come in (will be getting 5 or 6 local companies to quote on the replacement).

If anyone wants to quote we are in the PE1 3 postcode area.

 

[Agile]

Obviously he was trained at British Gas!

The reality is that your boiler has a low water content copper heat exchanger and a pretty high efficiency for a non condensing boiler.

The only negative aspects are the open flue and the permanent pilot light and its not modulating, just on/off modulation. But they are still irrelevant and as long as working well I would recommend keeping the boiler. All significant parts are still available in spite of what he decided to tell you!

You said loft insulation is a "good 6" but that is not good. Current spec is for twice that depth. My recommendation is to upgrade that and the reduced heat loss will make up for the slightly reduced efficiency compared with a modern condensing boiler.

Condensate can be pumped upwards and run out through the loft.

Tony Glazier

 

[FiremanT]

Parts appear to be available, but the seasonal efficiency is only 65% Group G. Also there will (should) be a permanent vent allowing cold air in.

 

[Jackrae]

It really doesn't matter how inefficient your old boiler is. As long as you can keep it operating safely and you're happy with your current set-up, any "loss" of money due to inefficiency will ALWAYS be less than the loss of capital and depreciation on a new boiler.
You might be wasting gas and not pleasing the "green police" but it ain't their money being used to finance the change (unless you can get a pensioner's grant to do a free exchange)

 

[mbaines1]

Thanks Tony, FiremanT and Jackrae The boiler is working fine at the moment and we are happy with it, and now I know parts are still available, replacement is no longer a major issue. What would be a problem is if it failed in mid winter and then having to replace boiler due to no parts being available (although we do have alternate heating/DHW options). During the summer when doing hot water only its using about 3m3 and in the coldest weather it goes up to about 80m3 of gas / week on average.

 

[Jackrae]

Most (or all) new boilers will breakdown at some time, usually when most inconvenient, so fitting a new complicated modern unit doesn't guarantee freedom from failure. There are many who will say it actually increases your chances of a breakdown.

 

[Agile]

That's is a very simple boiler and only has one common fault and that's the thermostats failing ( usually causing it to overheat ).

They are less than £20 so a very cheap part.

Tony

 

[mbaines1]

Yes - its overheat stat has failed a couple of times in its life so far. In 2001 it had a replacement gas valve as pilot light kept going out intermittently, after engineer had replaced thermocouple, and overheat stat. In recent years its only needed the occasional thermocouple when serviced / cleaned annually.

 

[Agile]

The thermocouple is a service part which is usually replaced every few years depending on the engineer.

But few owners actually get the boiler serviced every year so they usually wait until it fails and pay a bit more as a fault repair.

Tony