zoning central heating

[richardrich79]

At the moment when the CH pumps on the whole of the system heats up all the rads bar 1 have Thermostats on them and the main wireless thermostat's in the hall.
It's been suggested that as I'm disabled and therefore home each and every day it may be worth my while fitting valves to isolate the upstairs during the day.
Downstairs there are 3 rads one of which is the one that's always on, no thermostatic valve.
Question is, as both the pipes to the upper floors are easily located and it would be simple to add valves. do I need a valve on both the 'out' & 'return' or just 1.
As to the valve control does it have to be to a timer or will a simple on/off switch do?
WE've been very badly ripped off by our builder so the budget is very, very low.
Thanks

 

[Crezzer]

If there is seperate flow and return pipes for up and down then it would be quite simple, you would need to fit two zone valves only on the flow pipes and possibly a bypass valve, these could then be controlled by a programmer/timer and have a room stat for up and one for down. The roomstat would be your "switch"

 

[amuiphoto]

I use the Heatmiser wireless system in my house in combination with zone valves and wireless thermostats (battery operated). I have 3 zones set up, Bedrooms and bathroom, lounge and hallway and UFH in kitchen.
When the thermostat calls for heat the boiler fires up and the valve to that zone opens (fitted to the flow pipe) and allows the water to heat that area, the other valves remain closed thereby not wasting heat to unoccupied rooms.

 

[PotatoHead]

I really wouldn't bother, I doubt you will ever see a payback to zoning the system. If you switch off the heating upstairs during the day the heat from downstairs will simply 'leak' upstairs. The boiler will also cycle madly due to having such a low heat demand losing efficiency.

Just insulate the loft and cavity walls, if you're disabled I'm sure it's free.

 

[kbdiy]

Unless it's a large draughty old house, then I would tend to agree that there would be little payback on zoning the upstairs separately. If you have a typical 3-bed semi or smaller then I really wouldn't bother. Just insulate well as suggested above.

 

[DP]

Mine is a three bedroom semi and I DO have two heating zones. As the fuel gets more expensive, zone creation will become more acceptable.

When gas was cheap, cylinders were gravity circulation, only random installation of room thermostats and boilers would have been 50% efficient on a good day and most people only used coal as central heating was a luxury. Those were the days when people had black and white TV, telephone if you had one, might have been on a party line, Morris Minor, Ford Zephyrs and Vauxhall Vanguards were cars often seen on the roads.

On a different note, Honeywell have programmers that allow each radiator to act as a zone, so 10 rads equal 10 zones (plus bypass as required). i would think Honeywell is a big player that knows how the wind of change is blowing or they would not have installed installed assembly lines in their factory near Glasgow

 

[amuiphoto]

OP didn't specify how big his house is although he does mention upper floors implying more than one.
The reason I chose to zone my house is that it's a large victorian semi with 12 rads of various sizes on the upper floors. And also wet UFH in the kitchen. To have these all running when I'm spending time in my lounge all day would clearly be a waste of money. Also to have to adjust the Trvs on each one would take forever too.
The boiler doesn't cycle at all, if there's a call for heat in the lounge to say 21c then it fires until lounge reaches 21c then switches off. When the temp drops to 20c it will switch in again but this usually takes an hour or so - hardly cycling madly!
I can run my bedroom temperatures at 18c which is cause I prefer a cooler bedroom temp and sit watching telly at 22c and feel nice and toasty.

Now I've set the system as I want it I virtually never need to touch it, gone are the days of a single mechanical thermostat in the hallway trying to guess what temp it is in the lounge - embrace the technology, it's not that expensive.

 

[PotatoHead]

If the OP has 3 radiators downstairs then I'd guess it's a similar load upstairs. If it's a combi or a 18/24 Kw regular boiler I normally see installed then of course it will cycle.

To zone it I guess you could bodge it with a single zone valve on a switch that is turned on before going to bed. The problem with that is you will now be heating downstairs when you only want to heat upstairs. To do it properly will need a couple of zone valves (1 if you're lucky), prog. stat, re-wiring of sorts.

I'd also suggest looking at Evo-Home by Honeywell, will still give you problems with cycling on a small system but it looks snazzy. I don't doubt Honeywell can see where there's new money to be made with the wi-fi revolution. I recall looking for similar products nearly 10 years ago to no avail. If I go back to any of my installs over the years they all had 5 core to the prog stats in my belief i was making them 'wi-fi ready'.

There's stiill the question of what the payback time will be for the increased measures, inc. extra maintenance costs.

 

[kbdiy]

so the budget is very, very low.
Thanks

I was keeping this comment in mind as well. If the house is/can be well insulated then payback for an expensive revamp could be marginal at best. Sorting the basics first, which the OP has not commented on, may give a better idea of his best options.

More automation MAY be the best way but more detail about the property and boiler type would help make informed recommendations.

 

[richardrich79]

Thankyou to everyone, your comments have been very helpful.
I should have mentioned that the property is a 4 bed terraced house ( one bed being in the 'loft'). The boiler is an Ideal 35 combi running 9 rads however the rads in the kitchen and the bedroom immediately above it are superfluous as we have a solid fuel Rayburn which looks after that end of the house.
All in all taking everything into consideration I don't think it's really worth doing.
cheers