hang on, how 'yellow' does faded gloss white get actually?

[CluelessDIYer1]

I think i've been conned!

I always preferred the idea & look of gloss white for things like skirting, door frames/casing & stairs (spindles & bannister). Hard wearing, shiny to a degree. Nice look (imo). I was put off big time when i read on various sites inc. this one & told by people in the flesh that it fades, not only does it fade but it "yellows badly" & often quickly too. This seemed to be the common train of thought.

So i got visions of this...

As yellow as one of those or at least not very far off. Horrible.

It appears i MAY have been mislead.

So we opted for Satin. It's been a bloody nuisance to work with but we read that it was also hard wearing, although duller, but would do the job well.


The Mrs asked if i'd sanded down the bannister (i hadn't) as it had chipped & you could see gloss under the old satin. She said this is what gloss fades to ....... it wasn't yellow at all.

It was more an off white. Sorry i know that's very non-descript, so the best i can do is say it wasn't sparkling white, more teeth-white (but not like Simon Cowell). I could handle this as it was still white. Not mega-sparkling, but white. NOT 'yellow' or anywhere remotely near yellow.


So can anyone please enlighten me - when they say gloss yellows, what does it ACTUALLY turn to? Photos of this would be even better. I may switch to gloss.

On the topic of which, why does everyone seem to make out it's a nightmare to work with? What's so bad about it (having never used it before)?[/img]

 

[misterhelpful]

Oil gloss isn't a nightmare to work with - quite the opposite in fact. We have always loved oil based paints but in 2010 the regulations changed and paint manufacturers had to alter the VOC (volatile organic compounds) levels in their products. This led to the products being a bit harder to work with and longer drying times, but still better than the majority of water based finishes. The major downside was that the new formula paints would 'yellow' far, far quicker which led to many complaints.
You are right in what you say though, as the paint doesn't really go yellow, it is more of a creamy off-white colour. However, some of it does now get far darker than it used to, and starts to do so in a relatively short time (around 6 weeks).
The best oil based gloss I have used since the 2010 changes has been the newest Dulux Trade High Gloss formula (it has a blue lid to show it's the newer version). It is a liquid gloss and stays whiter than it's previous version, although does still yellow a little over time. The more natural light (UV) it gets, the less it yellows.
I suppose it's up to you if you can live with off-white paintwork - lots of people can't - but oil glosses have always yellowed to a certain degree anyway.

 

[CluelessDIYer1]

It all depends on how off white this 'off white' actually is. We're just hazarding a guess that the shiny stuff at home was old gloss that has faded. We're not sure how old it is can't see how quick it's gone in what sort of time frame.

I can live with off white so long as it still resembles white. So that if you looked at it, you'd not be saying that belongs to the yellow family, it belongs to white.

Just could be an expensive gamble, which is why it'd be brilliant if someone had any photos of theirs?

 

[misterhelpful]

Here are a couple of images of the 'white' woodwork in my house. This is the Dulux 'blue lid' gloss I mentioned previously, 10 months after application.

Door

• misterhelpful
• 9 Feb 2014
• 1

Dulux High Gloss White 10 months later with white ceiling as contrast.

Banister

• misterhelpful
• 9 Feb 2014
• 1

Dulux High Gloss White against 'Snowdrop' colour walls 10 months after application.

Hope this gives you an idea of what to expect. I'll try and add a few images of Crown Solo gloss in a few minutes.

Here are the Crown Solo (post 2010) images almost 2 years after application:

Door 2

• misterhelpful
• 9 Feb 2014
• 1

Post 2010 Crown Solo White Gloss almost 2 years after application with white ceiling as contrast.

Skirting

• misterhelpful
• 9 Feb 2014
• 1

Post 2010 Crown Solo White Gloss almost 2 years after application against 'Sand' colour walls.

Both of these rooms are North facing, with one window each, so receive average daylight. I've got a little of each ceiling showing so you can hopefully see the contrast between the whites.

*Edited to show which versions of gloss was used.

 

[sparkwright]

The yellowing can vary. I suppose this depends on the make, and which formula it has been made to.

Have seen different versions of Dulux gloss vary to different degrees.

The worst I have seen, on the net and in real life, is the colour of cheese, which just is not acceptable.

Other occasions where the brilliant white turns an off white and isn't too yellow seems fairly acceptable, and this has been the norm for many years.

Not seen any drastic yellowing outdoors yet, anyone?

Can anyone advise if the Dulux blue top stays reasonably white?

 

[emilybronte]

OP, it is not a case of 'satin' being less likely to yellow than 'gloss' - it's to do with whether it is oil or water/acrylic based.

Oil based gloss will be less likely to go yellow outdoors because the UV light in the sunshine will counteract this.

Indoors, I am struggling to understand why anyone still uses oilbased gloss. The post-2010 stuff is nothing like its pre-2010 counterpart and the new water based glosses, satinwoods and eggshells (esp.Johnstone's Aqua and Little Greene's) are getting better all the time. They dry much more quickly, they don't smell and above all they stay white (assuming they are white to begin with!)

 

[sagalout1954]

Dulux oil based gloss 2012, turned ugly cream colour in loo with no natural light within 2 weeks, looked even worse because of bright white suite.

Unfortunately did hall, bannisters, landing at same time......12 bl##dy doors!!! The areas/doors getting most sun reasonable, but make everywhere that doesn't look even more dingy coloured. Can't face redoing it all just yet.

Have used Johnsons aqua in living room and seems as bright white, even behind things, as it was 3 months ago. Thought it not being non drip might be a problem but it was fine.

Will be sticking with that in future.

 

[CluelessDIYer1]

A few things - who does decent water based gloss? The gloss i've been looking at is oil based & i've looked at a few. Not saying i've looked at them all, but the ones i have looked at ...

We've used a Crown oil based undercoat & a Crown water based satin. We didn't intend to do it that way. It was only once i'd painted the undercoat on & went to wash in water did i realise the difference.

Thanks for the photos misterhelpful. I think all those shots look perfectly fine.

I did go looking for the blue lid you mentioned in our local B&Q but there wasn't one.

I did find the Dulux Trade gloss though...

Dulux Trade High Gloss Pure Brilliant White: http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/paint-...-Paint-Brilliant-White-10299519?skuId=9260685
Dulux Trade High Gloss White: http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/paint-...High-Gloss-Paint-White-10299520?skuId=9260688


Aside from £5, what's the difference, or is it just marketing nonsense?



Oh & another i forgot about any water based gloss - how does it stack up vs oil based in terms of being hard wearing & also application?

 

[misterhelpful]

I did go looking for the blue lid you mentioned in our local B&Q but there wasn't one.

I did find the Dulux Trade gloss though...

Dulux Trade High Gloss Pure Brilliant White: http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/paint-...-Paint-Brilliant-White-10299519?skuId=9260685
Dulux Trade High Gloss White: http://www.diy.com/nav/decor/paint-...High-Gloss-Paint-White-10299520?skuId=9260688


Aside from £5, what's the difference, or is it just marketing nonsense?

I think the difference is because the more expensive one is the new formula. It looks like they've stopped using the blue lid system now and have just added 'New Improved Formula' to the labelling. I can't guarantee that is the case though.

I can't help much with the water based glosses as I don't use them, but I know the majority of them aren't anywhere near as hardwearing as the oil based ones.

 

[CluelessDIYer1]

That's the problem we have...

The windowsill has been done in satin. The door frames MAY get done in satin, but the stairs bannister & spindles - the Mrs really wants this done in gloss as folks grubby mitts will be all over it & it'll be the most likely thing to get a knocking. For that reason & that reason alone, she says she wants it glossed so that it has the best protection/most durable hard wearing paint on there.

I don't know how much gloss beats satin in that area (hard wearing'ness) - whether it's a lot or not much, but she's wanting something very hard wearing for that reason.

 

[emilybronte]

Gloss is generally more durable than satinwood (this is true of waterbased as well as oilbased).

If you want recommendations for waterbased, I'd go for Johnstone's Aqua system (undercoat and top coat). Be prepared to put at least two topcoats on and leave it to 'cure' for several days before touching it. The longer you leave it, the tougher it gets. Use a synthetic brush.

 

[Chri5]

Dulux blue top trade gloss is good.

Dulux blue top trade oil based satin is the absolute Daddy.

(I've being applying both over about 18 months to kill off the 1st gen voc products that turn toward magnolia within a year).


Trade paints tend to be slightly brighter, and have more pigment in them (in answer to your Q on what's the difference).