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17th edition questions


 
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markymark2406

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:31 am Reply with quote

Have a friend who is embarking on the 17th edition course we wa t to know what the pass mark is? And any online test questions ?
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chivers67

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:57 pm Reply with quote

Used to be around 60% or 65%

It's an open book test so if you do fail you've no excuses really apart from not knowing where to look in the book to assist with answers
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chivers67

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:59 pm Reply with quote

scroll down on this web page you may find it of some use -even before you start http://michaelmavin.org/static/edumenu.htm
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Taylortwocities

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:02 pm Reply with quote

So are you are talking about C&G 2382-20 based on 30 questions as opposed to C&G 2382-10 which is based on 60 questions. ?

I agree with chivers. It's multiple guess, the correct answer is there in front of you. Also you are allowed to take a book into the exam (BS7671) with all of the answers in it.

How difficult can that be?

IMO the pass mark should be 95%, there's no excuses.

Stop wasting your time worrying about the pass mark and get your nose into the regs book.

There's a load of questions here
http://www.djtelectraining.co.uk/17th_edition_questions.html

also try and GOOGLE "17th edition sample questions"

You'll be surprised what you will find
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ericmark

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 2:16 pm Reply with quote

The questions are taken from the text of the book and some times one feels not set by anyone with electrical knowledge.

There is not enough time to look up every question neither would anyone want to learn the whole book with some of the questions on the appendix section being something one will never need to know.

So one has to:-
First answer all the questions one knows the answer for.
Then answer the ones you need to look up.
The problem for electricians is the changes. One thinks one knows the answer but it's changed since last edition.

Some of the wording is not the best. A person with technical knowledge or sufficient experience to enable him/her to avoid dangers which electricity may create. Is Skilled but a Competent will also have that knowledge and experience but will also as well as him/herself also look after others. But a good course will highlight the common errors and you will look for the word "others" when selecting the name.
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Paul_C

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:31 pm Reply with quote

Quote:
60% or 65% {.....} It's an open book test


That would explain a lot. icon_sad.gif
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JohnW2

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:50 pm Reply with quote

Paul_C wrote:
Quote:
60% or 65% {.....} It's an open book test
That would explain a lot. icon_sad.gif

Indeed it would, but (at least in terms of pass mark - not the 'open book' bit!) it's far from unique to electricians. Those whose primary qualifications are university degrees, including those practising in the major professions (medicine, law, teaching etc.) will often be 'qualified' on the basis of exams with an overall pass mark not a lot over 50%, sometimes even as low as 40% or 45% ... so, theoretically, some of them could know less than half of what they would ideally know! That's why, in almost any walk of life, one has to look beyond paper qualifications to get any useful measure of 'competence'!

Kind Regards, John.
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Paul_C

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:29 am Reply with quote

JohnW2 wrote:
That's why, in almost any walk of life, one has to look beyond paper qualifications to get any useful measure of 'competence'!

Indeed. I was rather prompted to make my comment last night after having just read a question posted on another forum about a light-switching problem. It was clearly the once-common arrangement of 2-way switching for the upstairs landing light, with a 2-gang switch in the lower hallway to control the downstairs hall light as well, a 2-core red/black switch loop to each switch position for up & down, plus a 3-core red/white/blue running between the two switch positions to provide the 2-way switch link for the upstairs lights. The description of the wiring at the upstairs switch indicated "conventional" method as opposed to "conversion" method of wiring, but it seems that somebody had swapped around a couple of the conductors at the downstairs 2-way.

A "fully qualified electrician" was, apparently, then unable to sort it out because he said he didn't understand it and hadn't seen that method of wiring before, and from the description of what he tried then ended up doing all sorts of things like cross-connecting a live feed from the downstairs switch loop to the 3-core, etc.

Is it just me, or is it incredible (in a very sad sort of way), that a "qualified" electrician seems to be having so much difficulty straightening out a very basic 2-way switching circuit?

This is the sort of thing which tends to reinforce my belief that the training these days seems to consist more of step-by-step instructions (connect red to A, connect blue to B, put meter across A & B and if reading is less than whatever amount it's acceptable, and so on) rather than imparting a real understanding of basic fundamental principles to enable the person to tackle with confidence any problem which comes his way. If what he sees doesn't fit the narrow range of methods he's been taught, he's then lost as to know what to do next.
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ban-all-sheds

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:58 am Reply with quote

Well - good luck with promoting the idea that people should actually understand what they are doing, no matter who they are, and no matter what the work is, rather than just blindly following instructions to put this wire into that hole.

Expect to get used to being regularly criticised for it.
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JohnW2

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:46 pm Reply with quote

ban-all-sheds wrote:
Well - good luck with promoting the idea that people should actually understand what they are doing, no matter who they are, and no matter what the work is, rather than just blindly following instructions to put this wire into that hole. Expect to get used to being regularly criticised for it.

It's something I am (and will continue to be) proud to be criticised for saying!

Kind Regards, John.
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ban-all-sheds

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:10 pm Reply with quote

Don't make me laugh.

You regularly tell people how to do things, knowing that they don't genuinely understand, on the grounds that if you don't they'll blunder ahead anyway, and just as regularly criticise me for taking the stand that if they don't understand it they need to either go off and learn until they do or get an electrician.
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JohnW2

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:03 pm Reply with quote

ban-all-sheds wrote:
Don't make me laugh. You regularly tell people how to do things, knowing that they don't genuinely understand, on the grounds that if you don't they'll blunder ahead anyway, and just as regularly criticise me for taking the stand that if they don't understand it they need to either go off and learn until they do or get an electrician.

I do that as little as I can - and, when I do it, it's only because I feel that, in the particular situation, it is probably the least of the available evils - but it most certainly does not mean that I don't believe that anyone doing anything should have a full understanding of the underlying principles - which is far more important than 'chapter and verse knowledge'. My personal view is that their true understanding of the underlying principles is far more important than their understanding of word of the regulations or their compliance (or otherwise) with such things as notification to LABCs. You have only got to look at the level of understanding of basic principles of some of those who are allowed to self-certify to see the lunacy of the situation we currently have.

Kin Regards, John.
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Mrdjc (2 Dec 2011)
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