Removing Render from brickwork

[Lewjt]

I am a few weeks away from purchasing my first home and I have a few ideas whizzing around my head for things that need doing etc...

This is my first question so I hope I provide all the detail necessary.

The house was built circa 1900 and the the exterior walls have been rendered (Im not sure if it is lime or cement). The house is semi detached and the house that it is adjoined to has had the render removed. The brickwork looks ok (but I'm no expert). Other houses on the same street have render others don't.

Basically my questions are, is it safe to remove the render? Can I remove it myself or should I get somebody more qualified to do it? if I can do it myself, how do I do it? And finally, do I need to do anything to the brickwork after the render has been removed?

Any advice would be greatly received. [/img]

 

[dmplastering]

I am a few weeks away from purchasing my first home and I have a few ideas whizzing around my head for things that need doing etc...

This is my first question so I hope I provide all the detail necessary.

The house was built circa 1900 and the the exterior walls have been rendered (Im not sure if it is lime or cement). The house is semi detached and the house that it is adjoined to has had the render removed. The brickwork looks ok (but I'm no expert). Other houses on the same street have render others don't.

Basically my questions are, is it safe to remove the render? Can I remove it myself or should I get somebody more qualified to do it? if I can do it myself, how do I do it? And finally, do I need to do anything to the brickwork after the render has been removed?

Any advice would be greatly received. [/img]

hello, welcome to the forum,
have a read of this, think it might help you

//www.diynot.com/forums/plaste...top-of-painted-textured-external-wall.309671/

 

[Richard C]

A few words of warning; you need to be aware that removal/replacement of render form the outside (& inside of an outside wall) of a building is controlled by Building Regulations ( Part L). The render is considered a thermal element & if you change more than 24% of any thermal element of a building, BR’s require you to upgrade to the latest thermal insulation requirements. If it gets spotted by your LABC (& it happens more often than you might think), you could be in for a rather nasty & expensive shock. Obviously outside is more noticeable but you can also get caught out if you do it inside & are having other notifyable building works inspected.

 

[peaps]

A few words of warning; you need to be aware that removal/replacement of render form the outside (& inside of an outside wall) of a building is controlled by Building Regulations ( Part L). The render is considered a thermal element & if you change more than 24% of any thermal element of a building, BR’s require you to upgrade to the latest thermal insulation requirements. If it gets spotted by your LABC (& it happens more often than you might think), you could be in for a rather nasty & expensive shock. Obviously outside is more noticeable but you can also get caught out if you do it inside & are having other notifyable building works inspected.

It's not as black or white as this.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADL1B_2010.pdf

To cut a long story short, you will be ok to remove the external render.

 

[Richard C]

It's not as black or white as this.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADL1B_2010.pdf

To cut a long story short, you will be ok to remove the external render.

Care to explain why?

 

[peaps]

It's not as black or white as this.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADL1B_2010.pdf

To cut a long story short, you will be ok to remove the external render.

Care to explain why?

I posted the document to save long dranw out explanations.

 

[Richard C]

I posted the document to save long dranw out explanations.

Doesn’t really help much; I know the document, for my & particularly the OP’s understanding, care to indicate which parts of it you think allow it?

 

[peaps]

I posted the document to save long dranw out explanations.

Doesn’t really help much; I know the document, for my & particularly the OP’s understanding, care to indicate which parts of it you think allow it?

Like I have said, I posted the document so we have no need for a long drawn out explanation. And we don't have the full details of the house.

For instance, is the house cavity walled, if so has it already had cavity wall insulation, has the internal walls been boarded and insulated, what area is to come off (not all walls come under the regs) and so on.

The walls might already exceed the required thermal protection.....

Why is he removing the render? It maybe that it's having a detramental affect on the building, it may have been rendered years after...

Many things come into play but I can tell you that a building built in 1900 has more room to move on the regs than a new build, loop holes.

So unless you are aware of the full facts it would be a waste of time going into long drawn out explanations, would it not?

 

[Lewjt]

Thankyou for your responses.

I think the best thing to do is to speak to whoever regulates building control. Does anyone have idea who that is? (is it my local council?)

Also, if I get the go ahead to remove it, would I need to do anything to the brickwork afterwards (for waterproofing or alike?)

Thanks again

 

[peaps]

Thankyou for your responses.

I think the best thing to do is to speak to whoever regulates building control. Does anyone have idea who that is? (is it my local council?)

Also, if I get the go ahead to remove it, would I need to do anything to the brickwork afterwards (for waterproofing or alike?)

Thanks again

Just clean the brick and point it with lime.

If the building has been rendered years after and it's done in s&c you will have a good argument to remove it, if it has cavity wall insulation you will have a good argument to remove it also.

 

[peaps]

http://www.historic-scotland.gov.uk/hstp102011-u-values-and-traditional-buildings.pdf

This may help you.

 

[Richard C]

Like I have said, I posted the document so we have no need for a long drawn out explanation. And we don't have the full details of the house.

For instance, is the house cavity walled, if so has it already had cavity wall insulation, has the internal walls been boarded and insulated, what area is to come off (not all walls come under the regs) and so on.

The walls might already exceed the required thermal protection.....

Why is he removing the render? It maybe that it's having a detramental affect on the building, it may have been rendered years after...

Many things come into play but I can tell you that a building built in 1900 has more room to move on the regs than a new build, loop holes.

So unless you are aware of the full facts it would be a waste of time going into long drawn out explanations, would it not?

All of which you say is true but equally, you can’t just advise;

To cut a long story short, you will be ok to remove the external render.

My aim was to give the OP the heads up. It’s not always cut & dried & depends on the particular circumstances of the property but, nevertheless, the OP may get a nasty shock & at the very least involve a whole load of aggravation regarding the current/required thermal efficiency of the property; if in any doubt, consult LABC before starting work.

There are several instances on this forum where OP’s have fallen foul of this; here are a couple but there are others if you’ve time to search;
//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=149462&start=0

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1699444#1699444

 

[peaps]

Like I have said, I posted the document so we have no need for a long drawn out explanation. And we don't have the full details of the house.

For instance, is the house cavity walled, if so has it already had cavity wall insulation, has the internal walls been boarded and insulated, what area is to come off (not all walls come under the regs) and so on.

The walls might already exceed the required thermal protection.....

Why is he removing the render? It maybe that it's having a detramental affect on the building, it may have been rendered years after...

Many things come into play but I can tell you that a building built in 1900 has more room to move on the regs than a new build, loop holes.

So unless you are aware of the full facts it would be a waste of time going into long drawn out explanations, would it not?

All of which you say is true but equally, you can’t just advise;

To cut a long story short, you will be ok to remove the external render.

My aim was to give the OP the heads up. It’s not always cut & dried & depends on the particular circumstances of the property but, nevertheless, the OP may get a nasty shock & at the very least involve a whole load of aggravation regarding the current/required thermal efficiency of the property; if in any doubt, consult LABC before starting work.

There are several instances on this forum where OP’s have fallen foul of this; here are a couple but there are others if you’ve time to search;
//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=149462&start=0

//www.diynot.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1699444#1699444[/QUOTE]

In my IMO he is ok to remove it.

Moving on.

 

[Richard C]

I think the best thing to do is to speak to whoever regulates building control. Does anyone have idea who that is? (is it my local council?)

You have peaps “opinion” but that would be wise IMO. I advise you phone your Local Authority Building Control (LABC), hopefully this is the right link;
http://www.labc.uk.com/Regions/west_midlands

Explain what you want to do & seek their guidance on your particular circumstances before you start; if they say OK to go ahead, get it in writing.

Definitely moving on!

 

[peaps]

Permission has been granted to carry on with the rendering with a condition of installing roof insulation.

Here is my reply I received with regards to the thermal properties of render:

In the Building Regulations there is the following definition:

"Renovation in relation to a thermal element means the provision of a new layer in the thermal element or the replacement of an existing layer, but excludes decorative finishes, and ‘renovate’ shall be construed accordingly. "

The latest version of the Approved Document contains the following extra advice

"Examples of decorative finishes are paint and wallpaper etc that add no appreciable thermal resistance, and thin polymer foam sheeting for decorators to apply under wallpaper to reduce condensation risk. Dry-lining and external renders are not decorative finishes because they add thermal resistance."

So, as far as the Building Regulations are concerned, external render does have thermal properties. - However to me this does not answer the question as to what thermal properties sand and cement actually have?

I still believe that we should have been able to carry on this work without any conditions due to the economic feasibility of the insulation panels. However, roof insulation will be of benefit and we would like to get the job finished.

I pulled this off the link you provided, Plaster is classed as decorative.....

But woody hit the nail on the head.