National Grid want to move gas meter in garage

[andybiochem]

Hi all,

I've had some good advice from this forum before, so hoping you can all help again!

A couple of months ago we had a gas leak, and I phoned the National Grid (NG) who promptly came over and we eventually got it sorted. When the NG engineer was at the property he told us that the gas meter was 'built over' and he would have to report us to the NG, who would demand that it is moved. We have since had letters from NG confirming this.

We bought the house a couple of years ago, and have not made any major alterations at all, just basic decorating. The house was built in 1973 with a (single skin) brick garage, within which is housed the gas meter sunken into the main house wall (double skin).

The gas feed comes out of the concrete floor of the garage via a plastic pipe, runs directly up on the surface of the (inside) garage wall for 20cm or so, then into the meter box...so the pipe work is not in a cavity at all.

This situation has been fine for over 41 years, but now is apparently suddenly a problem!

I can't say I'm thrilled about having an exposed plastic gas pipe running in the garage, which is obviously huge risk if there is a fire. Also, we'd like one of the new smart meter things, so if the meter has to be moved then so be it.

My question is, am I liable for the expense of moving the meter? The NG chap mumbled something about NG not charging for work done in some circumstances where you weren't responsible.

Anyone have any experience with this?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Agile]

Others may have comments to add.

Mine is that you are not allowed to have plastic pipes inside a building.

Nor inside a cavity wall either!

The simplest solution would probably be to have an external meter box in the same location with the plastic pipe coming up the outside of the building.

But I see quite a few like yours around and nobody seems to be bothered.

I guess that the engineer reported it and now its in a system and being brought forward regularly.

I suspect that if you ignored them they will eventually go away!

But if you would like it sorted out then they should do that at no cost to you as long as they have initiated the work.

Tony

 

[jamesnewhere]

National Grid may go away at some time but the risk that has been explained to you in writing following a qualified persons visit will not.

Can of worms situation if you want to sell your property and maybe your house insurance company needs to be told of the risk.

To sum up,once a risk is made aware it needs attention and a plastic gas pipe in a vulnerable area is fairly high risk.

Good luck.

 

[Tipper]

Sounds like the garage was added after the house was built and the meter box ended up inside.

NG are just wanting the meter box outside. In NG's eyes you are responsible for whatever the previous owners have done to the property as you are the current owner. I suspect that you will end up paying.

 

[andybiochem]

Thanks for the replies!

But if you would like it sorted out then they should do that at no cost to you as long as they have initiated the work.

Tony

I've heard someone quote something similar that falls under the 'Gas Act'. Is there something like this we could present to the National Grid that might result in them footing the bill - we really can't afford the 1000's that this would likely cost.

We're pretty much resigned to the fact that it will have to be moved, I just can't believe that the NG can suddenly change their rules and then sit back and watch money coming in from the public as they scramble to get the changes made.

What when in a few years NG decide that the meter box being outside is a safety issue due to the threat of vandals, and meters should now be indoors?

 

[Agile]

You have not commented on Tipper's suggestion the garage was added later.

If it was original and the gas was supplied like that from the outset then my view is that you should be able to successfully argue that you should not have to pay.

I suggest you go along with their wish to do the work but make it clear that it is only on the basis that its at no cost to you.

It would usually cost about £1000.

Tony

 

[andybiochem]

You have not commented on Tipper's suggestion the garage was added later.

If it was original and the gas was supplied like that from the outset then my view is that you should be able to successfully argue that you should not have to pay.

From the original designs that were left by the previous owner who owned it from being built in 1973, it appears that the garage was built at the same time as the house.

The designs show where waste pipes are underground but there is no mention of gas pipes that I can see.

[EDIT]

I've just had a look at some photos the owner also left showing the construction of the house. It's clear from the photos that both the gas and electricity boxes haven't been moved at all since the house was built. So it does look like they were originally designed to be 'built over' in the garage in 1973.

 

[Agile]

Whilst I dont know the dates, its a little surprising to me if gas supply pipes were being fitted with plastic pipes in 1973.

Are you totally sure they are really plastic and not just plastic covered steel pipe or just encased in a plastic duct? A magnet might help to test this.

Tony

 

[Bosswhite]

Many properties built around that era had Gas/ Electricity/Water meters situated inside the property, its only recently that these are being placed outside a property.
I would dispute it with the Gas Board its in their interest (reading the meters) to have it situated outside a property

As Agile has said its plastic coated steel pipe.

 

[doitall]

Point of note, if the meters were intended to be in the garage they wouldn't have wasted a meter box.

Meter box = outside at some time.

 

[Agile]

Oddly, Henry, you have not mentioned neighbours.

Unless your house was a one off then you should look at nearby houses and see how their gas meters are fitted.

Also helps to get to know your neighbours!

Tony

 

[MeterMonkey]

AFAIK, if you bought the property after the extension was built over the service, you wouldn't have to pay, but you would probably have to prove it.

The engineer was right that you're not allowed built over service.

 

[andybiochem]

Oddly, Henry, you have not mentioned neighbours.

Unless your house was a one off then you should look at nearby houses and see how their gas meters are fitted.

Also helps to get to know your neighbours!

Tony

Nearly all the houses on the street are the same - built over meters. None appear to have outside boxes, and all are the same basic design. Most have had extensions built over the years.

AFAIK, if you bought the property after the extension was built over the service, you wouldn't have to pay, but you would probably have to prove it.

This is sort of the point… the garage doesn't appear to be an extension, the original plans show the garage to have been part of the original build. The photos I have of the build taking place show the position of the gas meter to be the same as it is now - ergo facto the property was designed from day 1 to have a built over gas meter.

It looks like it will be very easy to prove that the situation has been like this for over 40 years, but I'd hoped there was some section of the Gas Act (if that even exists) that I could quote that does deal directly with this predicament.


I guess the proof of the pudding is now in the eating - we'll have to arrange for the site survey to take place.

Thanks for all the replies!

 

[doitall]

Perhaps the garage is longer than planned or forward to the drawing position.

As said if it was planned the services would be in the garage the would has fixed them to the wall at high level normally, and certainly not bothered with meter boxes.

Still not sure what the jobsworth is on about, there must be thousands in kitchen cupboards, under stairs etc