large garden shed roof problem

14hd · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:55 pm Post Subject: large garden shed roof problem

Can anyone tell me if i am correct in assuming that a dutch barn style roof is classed as a dual pitch roof? If so is there a legal doccument to use as proof to a council planning enforcer.

hotrod · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 7:20 pm Post Subject:

Do you want to elaborate on the issue?

14hd · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:32 pm Post Subject: large shed problem

Hi Hotrod thanks for replying. Basically the problem i have is i origanally applied for planning to build a 4mtr high dual pitch roofed wooden shed 2mtrs away from the boundary at an eaves height of 2.1mtrs high with the roof starting at a steep angle joining to a shallower angle (dutch barn or gambrel type roof on two sides. I was told to withdraw the planning application as i was told that the building didn't need planning permission as it fell within the permitted developement laws. So i did this and proceeded to build at first the inspector who came out without letting us know, saw a steel frame which had a flat spine which was due to have a large central beam for the dual apex fitted that day. She reported back to the enforcement officer stating that it had been built with a flat roof which was not the case and i had to spend hours on the internet looking up the terminology to explain this. (which he reluctantly agreed with andwe were told to proceed with completion). Eight weeks after the building was completed we had another letter from the enforcement officer saying he had referred the problem to a casebook study who didn't agree with the roof shape stating it wasn't a dual pitch roof and needed to come down and be altered. I then spent lots more hours looking at the term of a dual pitch roof and found a few websites that said a dual pitch roof ie gambrel type roof is two planes going into a central ridge. It doesn't say how many angles or what shape just that it goes to a central ridge and i need legal proof from a uk source as thy don't agree with international terms which these sites only seem to state point blank the terms of the wording "Dual Pitch Roof" Hope this is something you can tell me about.

^woody^ · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:36 pm Post Subject:

hotrod wrote:

Do you want to elaborate on the issue?

Can someone please summarise the issues?

(paragraphs and bullet points are good)

freddymercurystwin · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:43 pm Post Subject:

Not just me then!

14hd · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:46 pm Post Subject: large shed

Hi Woody,
The issues are i need to convince the planning enforcer to accept that the term dual pitch isn't just for one style of roof but for any that have a central ridge. i need to get it rsolved though as i am converting the original garge into a room in the house which is the builder cannot do until we have got approval by legal means without costing me too much to pay out for my solicitor, who is trying to resolve the matter but has come up against a brick wall of stubbourness trying to beat common sense. So if anyone knows of a british doccument with this clause in it i'd be really grateful of any advice.

freddymercurystwin · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:53 pm Post Subject:

A dual pitched roof is one that has two different pitches from the eaves up to the ridge at the highest point. Are the planers saying otherwise? If so what are they saying? Its still not overly clear from your post.

14hd · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:04 pm Post Subject: large shed

Hi Freddymercurystwin
Yes they are saying that a dutch barn / Gambrel roof is not a dual pitch roof.

freddymercurystwin · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:19 pm Post Subject: Re: large shed

14hd wrote:

dutch barn

As I understand it this is a reference to barns not their roof shape although it too is in the Oxford English Dictionary a farm building comprising a curved roof set on an open frame, used to cover hay.

14hd wrote:

Gambrel roof

This is a dual pitched roof, a roof having a shallower slope above a steeper one on each side, its in the Oxford English Dictionary as such.

From that I'd conclude that they are two different things, a dutch barn can have a gambrel roof but the term 'dutch barn roof' does not exist.

^woody^ · Posted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:37 pm Post Subject:

If the planner does not know what a pitched roof is, then I fear that you are wasting your time, as you will never get through

I really can't believe that a planner would/could be so thick

This sounds interesting though, but the issues are still not clear

Can you post or email the exact text from the planners letter(s) and an image or suchlike, so that the issues are clear?
No need for address or other personal information, just the body of the text, so that the planners point of view can be determined?

big-all · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:03 am Post Subject:

for those confused here is the issue
a flat roof can only be 3m high where as an apex roof can be 4m high without planning permision or at least it could be now its 3m for apex and less for flat roof [i think

]
so the planning think its a flat roof

__________________
big all
we are------------------ all still learning

^woody^ · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:13 am Post Subject:

I've definitely got an headache now. Pass the Nurofen

^woody^ · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 12:19 am Post Subject:

Build regs define a flat roof as any roof up to 10 degrees pitch. Anything over that is a pitched roof

14hd · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 6:55 pm Post Subject: large shed problem

Hi Woody.
Did you get the email okay? Does it make sense?

freddymercurystwin · Posted: Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:14 pm Post Subject:

^woody^ wrote:

Build regs define a flat roof as any roof up to 10 degrees pitch.

Not just the building regs but the British Standards too, with the best will in the world I cannot see how you could call that a dual pitched roof, its a pitched roof with a flat roof on top.