Smoke detector

russellsmiler · 27 Jan 2015

As some may know i am posting here pretty regular as part of my on-going electric works at hoem, however have a query at work that thought may be interesting to post.

A smallish (but detailed) refurbishment of a property in wales for a (lets say top flight) architect (gerkin team) is slowly starting to get towards completion, on friday i met with the client to go through any changes ammendments to ongoing details required, he as requested this one!, it would benefit from a picture but havent one sorry, the ceiling in the stairwell as been kept to its full volume right to its peak, so we have pitched ceiling with an adjoining bathroom wall, at approx 450mm below the peak the bathroom/stairwell wall as been left out to form an opening the pitched ceiling line goes through this opening in the bathroom, this wall is 150mm thick, so we basically have a triangular oprning at high level which as a 150mm flat surfce. Client wants to re-locate (1st fixed) the smoke alarm to this position, it will be no more than 3 m from any bedroom door, it will obviously be to some extent positioned upside down.
would this conform to regulations and if not why not

Bear in mind the client is not in the least bit interested in it being there at all as the property is so small and feels protected by the one at bottom of stairs and adjoining kitchen, so purely for having the installation certified for insurances etc, could this be achieved.

Many thanks
Russell

russellsmiler · 27 Jan 2015

Just to add, I am not the electrician, i purely manage projects of this nature as part of my employment.

Taylortwocities · 27 Jan 2015

You have two issues:

1. There may be requirements from the local authority as to the siting and interlinking of the smoke alarms.

2. There will be requirements from the maker of the smoke alarm as to its position. It sounds to me that the location may be in a "dead" spot where smoke may not reach, so the alarm may not sound.

seasickstevie · 28 Jan 2015

Well it would 'sound' if it's interlinked with others, and one of the others are triggered.

But as TCT says if it's in a dead spot, it ain't going to smell the smoke.

By your description it sounds like it's going to sit on the 'shelf', but I may have interpreted it wrong.

RF Lighting · 28 Jan 2015

I can't quite understand where you're trying to site your smoke alarm, but here's a handy guide from aico.

http://www.aico.co.uk/Where-do-I-site.html

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russellsmiler · 28 Jan 2015

Yes, good point it will be interlinked so would sound off if smoke was detected in other areas, of course fire could start on the landing and this would have to be the master detector.

It is as suggested sitting on a shelf, and lets say "upside down" although not sure if this makes a difference, please see sketch below, the the wall divides the landing with the bathroom, i understand it may fire of the steam from the bathroom (thats another issue)

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ban-all-sheds · 28 Jan 2015

Why can't it go here:

russellsmiler · 28 Jan 2015

that what youve added to the sketch is the current position!

The reason for the proposed position is to conceal it from sight, the ceiling as some very crisp features and bespoke lighting! a smoke detector interupts the aesthetics, this project is very bespoke, very detailed, and very enjoyable to be working on.

ban-all-sheds · 28 Jan 2015

So it's enjoyable to have a client who is such a blithering idiot that he'd sacrifice safety for the sake of cosmetic appearances?

russellsmiler · 28 Jan 2015

haha BAS just think how many occurences in life are all around were the cosmetic appearance is no 1 and any residual nastiness, safety, welfare, etc is pushed to one side.

ban-all-sheds · 28 Jan 2015

Lots.

And behind them all is a blithering idiot, quite often one who shouldn't be doing the job he's being paid to do.

Taylortwocities · 28 Jan 2015

Russgrimace

So, you propose to put the smoke alarm on the flat surface, pointing upwards?
You may as well just put a saucer there for the good it will do.

Firstly it will not detect any smoke there, your clients will burn to death and their relatives will sue your ass for incompetence.

Secondly it will soon fill up with dust and will sound off at 3:45am. They'll phone you at 3:46am to come and fix it.

The AICO guide shows where they can go. That's it.

flameport · 28 Jan 2015

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flameport
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russellsmiler · 28 Jan 2015

hey flameport, that's the most ridiculous bit of phsyco fear **** i've ever read, most guys here need to spend some time in a third world environment to realise that we are belt, braces ,nails and laces when it comes to our domestic existence, for petes sake just trying to get a simple question bottomed out. course the detector will work up there, in fact the smoke detector will probably get a direct draw across it by way of the chimmey effect of this opening, lets get real i've explained its a small property, there is another liked alarm at bottom of small staircase + one in kitchen which the stairs lead into.. the place is very crisp and contains minimal combustibles, its not the home of a hoarder.

I simply ask does anyone know if by way of regulation is it a tick or a cross for this installation.

flameport · 28 Jan 2015

russellsmiler said:
hey flameport, that's the most ridiculous bit of phsyco fear s**t i've ever read

In that case you obviously haven't seen the website that the picture came from. Or much else.

russellsmiler said:
I simply ask does anyone know if by way of regulation is it a tick or a cross for this installation.

Already answered several times by others.
For the avoidance of doubt:
NO you cannot put a smoke alarm there. It will NOT work.

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Smoke detector

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