Yes, when I started going to standards committee meetings, I used to have to take 2 suitcases, one for clothes and one (small, but heavy) for the papers. These days it's just a laptop bag with a few clothes squeezed in.Indeed! However, I have to say that, speaking personally, it has, at last, actually happened for me in the past few years. I have several rooms, and a loft, stuffed full of boxes and files of (probably 30+ years of) 'papers' (I would imagine probably totalling millions of sheets), but I have added very little to that pile in the last decade, and very little at all in the past 5 years. I used to get through at least a ream or two, often more, of printer paper every week, but one ream now lasts me months. There also used to be a constant stream of couriers at my door, bringing and taking massive paper documents - and I haven't seen one of those for a number of years.Remember when the advent of computers carried the boast of the paperless office ?
... so it can happen
Kind Regards, John
PAT (testing)
- Thread starter danechip
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Regarding leaving the side off, I used to do that until I realised the cooling is usually better with all panels in place, so the airflow is from the front filter to the rear. Otherwise the fans just stir the warm air about.
In that situation the whole metal chassis and case of the computer are going to become live. This applies regardless of whether the lid is on or not.
A large part of the reason for doing inspection and testing (both PAT and installation) is to reduce the risk of that happening by catching and repairing broken earths.
I can't see any reason why it should be considered unsafe. The outputs from the PSU are low enough voltage and sufficiantely isolated not to present a hazard (if they weren't then all the IO connectors on your PC would be hazardous). Furthermore plenty of PCs have covers that can be removed without a tool, that wouldn't be allowed if the cover was there for safety.
Sadly most PAT testing is done by barely trained operators who have no real clue what they are doing. I could easilly see one of them failing anything with a missing cover without stopping to consider whether said cover was actually covering anything hazardous.
We seem to think similarly ....
However, as you go on to say ...
... which is clearly a serious risk. It's a bit like the discussion I've been having with EFLI about using a water pipe as its own bonding conductor - I fear that, despite the regulations (and, I would say, electrical common sense), I fear that it would get 'coded' on an EICR by a high proportion of electricians - and, unlike many of the 'PAT operators', anyone undertaking an EICR is hopefully fairly well trained.
Kind Regards, John
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Precisely,
The point of my rhetorical question was not that the PSU output voltages were hazardous but that the metal enclosure of the PSU could develop a "mains" potential if it was neither earthed or certified as double insulated (and therefore not requiring one)
The point of my rhetorical question was not that the PSU output voltages were hazardous but that the metal enclosure of the PSU could develop a "mains" potential if it was neither earthed or certified as double insulated (and therefore not requiring one)
But as people keep pointing out, if that were to happen and the case was fully assembled the case would become live.
Almost certainly not, at least in the vast majority of cases. Some are being retained (for specific periods, or 'indefinitely') because of contractual and/or regulatory requirements but, in the great majority of cases, they are being retained only because "I don't feel comfortable to destroy them". Furthermore, secure destruction would not represent a trivial expense!
True, but in view of the above, it would not be appropriate or cost-justifiable!You need a few scanners and a team of interns....
Kind Regards, John
That sounds like 'off' to meWith my system the way it "alarms" the admins is to go into no POST no video mode.
Can't this microswitch be disarmed with a bit of tape or a paperclip/whatever? Kind Regards, John
It terms of the general temperature of the air inside the case that might possibly be true (although I'm far from convinced even about that), but that's not the main issue - don't forget that many/most PCs do not have 'case fans' (when they do, you may be right). The CPU fan and PSU fans should still do their jobs of taking heat away from the CPU or PSU. In any event, if one 'stirs air about' within a case which has no side, there is going to be a lot of mixing with surrounding room air. If one is really concerned, one can lie the PC on its side (open side up!) (which I sometimes do), and thereby make use of the fact that 'heat rises'!
Kind Regards, John
Indeed it can, providing its existence and function is known in advance.Can't this microswitch be disarmed with a bit of tape or a paperclip/whatever?
Or it can be removed and a jumper placed across a couple of motherboard pins. Providing its existence and function is known in advance.
Or its function can be disabled in the BIOS. Providing its existence and function is known in advance.
But once triggered......
Oh - does it do something (semi) permanent 'once triggered'? I had imagined that one could 'deal with' the microswitch (and/or jumpers and/or BIOS) and then power off/on and be back in business.Indeed it can, providing its existence and function is known in advance. Or it can be removed and a jumper placed across a couple of motherboard pins. Providing its existence and function is known in advance. Or its function can be disabled in the BIOS. Providing its existence and function is known in advance. But once triggered......Can't this microswitch be disarmed with a bit of tape or a paperclip/whatever?
Kind Regards, John
many brand name machines use airguides and chassis fans to do all the cooling (barring the PSU)
They'll have a fanless CPU heatsink, a big fan on the case and will rely on the airflow thru the chassis with the side on to properly cool everything.
When running with the side off, things can often get uncomfortably hot due to the lack of airflow in the right places. For instance it might well cool the CPU, but doesnt then flow any air over the hard disks or ram etc.
My work uses solely dell hardware and ive never seen a no post due to chassis intrusion switch. Most you get is a bios warning and prompt for setup password if enabled.
They'll have a fanless CPU heatsink, a big fan on the case and will rely on the airflow thru the chassis with the side on to properly cool everything.
When running with the side off, things can often get uncomfortably hot due to the lack of airflow in the right places. For instance it might well cool the CPU, but doesnt then flow any air over the hard disks or ram etc.
My work uses solely dell hardware and ive never seen a no post due to chassis intrusion switch. Most you get is a bios warning and prompt for setup password if enabled.
Yes, I've conceded that if there are case/chassis fans, then one does need the side on the case for the cooling to work properly. I guess my experience is at the lower end of the market - I've had umpteen PCs (and still have many of them, working!), nearly all "brand name" ones, but have never had one with any case fans. In the absence of such fans, I'm not convinced that having the side off does any great harm - although I suppose that the PSU fan may 'suck' air over various things (like the hard disks and RAM you mention) if the side is on.
Kind Regards, John
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