FAQs : CALLING ALL GAS FITTERS

the the worst in the history of boilers

introducing the MHS strata

and if anyone is unfourtunate enough to come across a sensor fault, bear this in mind

hrpc parts centre what ever they want call them selves, will supply you with the wrong replacement :evil: :evil:
 
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the the worst in the history of boilers

introducing the MHS strata

and if anyone is unfourtunate enough to come across a sensor fault, bear this in mind

hrpc parts centre what ever they want call them selves, will supply you with the wrong replacement :evil: :evil:

And what model would that be :rolleyes:

From experience MHS boilers are one of the best on the market, cannot comment on the 31s & 47s combi though, but would expect them to be reliable if installed correctly
 
I must say t hat I have never knowingly come across one of them

any pics of the on t'net?
 
cant remember the precise model but the single can strata
uses the siemens control and that open circuit board on the fan
they since altered it by coating it with a water proof layer
wow spill water on it
whoa :eek: :eek:

and as for the sensor, the one supposedly supplied reads in reverse
:rolleyes:

remembering now it has to be a landis sensor not the one supplied by hrpc
 
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Gentlemen, you may be right, you may be wrong, but even if you are right and let’s say a Vaillant sine is the best boiler ever made, I doubt many of us will be able to install one. Could be me, but I haven’t seen one in a catalogue for a while.

I think uncle Bahco meant currently available models

Cm, what makes you say condensing boilers MUST be replaced after 10 years?
 
Gentlemen, you may be right, you may be wrong, but even if you are right and let’s say a Vaillant sine is the best boiler ever made, I doubt many of us will be able to install one. Could be me, but I haven’t seen one in a catalogue for a while.

Cm, what makes you say condensing boilers MUST be replaced after 10 years?


MM I shouldnt have used the words HAVE TO but I dont see many of these ally HEX lasting any longer than ten years

most of em seem to fail after 5

:)
 
Thanks DIA

Nope I have never lock horns wif one of them yet

:)

Only comment I have about them is the electrics, you need a degree in rocket science if you go for the full works.

Was called out over Christmas to a job we installed (low water) the boilers and controls are all on the guys computer, he can sit at his desk and control the whole very large house, including the underfloor, rads and hot water temps :cool: it will even show faults and possible solutions, with a self diagnostic program with a full log of previous run states and times. :cool:
 
MM I shouldnt have used the words HAVE TO but I dont see many of these ally HEX lasting any longer than ten years

most of em seem to fail after 5

:)


Typical case of: time will tell.

As for ally, it is more sensitive to acid than steel or copper, hence no flushing with fx2.

Most of the conventional boilers I have replaced, guestimate around 70%, died due to corrosion with the occasional system showing a ph of about 4.
I will quite happily accept that ph 5 or 4 would kill an ally hex in 5 to 10 years.
That is why I almost always powerflush a system for a day and adding ample neutraliser afterwards before putting the new kettle in.
Sufficient inhibitor upon installation and a ph check at the annual service should prevent any corrosion.
And don’t forget, over here the majority of people see a HE boiler as a novelty but they have been around for more than half a century and have been more or less the standard thing on the continent for around 20 years.

Had another example why not to go for halstead today, 50 quid for an aps on a finest platinum! Thought I was hallucinating.
 
Was called out over Christmas to a job we installed (low water) the boilers and controls are all on the guys computer, he can sit at his desk and control the whole very large house, including the underfloor, rads and hot water temps :cool: it will even show faults and possible solutions, with a self diagnostic program with a full log of previous run states and times. :cool:

what boiler/ software?

sounds interesting
 
Broag Remeha.

the software was made/designed for the job, I can get the guys phone number if you're interested
 
Yessir milord DIA, pretty please with sugar on top, phone number would be great, accompanied with email or website even better.

Very interesting indeed. With energy prised likely to double again in the coming decade, boilers getting more sophisticated, computers getting cheaper and cheaper and software becoming semi-user-friendly, I can see that leading to this sort of stuff entering mainstream use.
Currently and in the next few years probably mainly for the high-end market, but who would object to a piece of that pie?
 
Send me an E and I'll get it when in the office monday/Tuesday
 
In trying to explain this my post has turned into a bit of a history lesson with a bit of a rant.

Favourite old boiler was anything more or less with a cast iron HE, a v4600 gas valve and a bog basic boiler stat. I've wittered on before about my old Thorn Olympic bf that has had 2 gas valves 3 thermocouples and 4 services in the last 21 years that I've been here and expect it had nothing in the preceding 3 or 4 years before I moved in. Ive only topped up the inhibitor twice and the old smc pump is still bopping away. I've found the sweet spot between 3 and 3 1/2 on the stat where it doesn't kettle too much. Long may it reign. Pilot's getting a little dirty now and I'll put a new injector in within the next couple of years.
Thorn M series Baxi 401 - 552, wm series Myson housewarmers and old glow worm bbu's more or less all come under this category as there's little in them to go wrong.
Things started to get bothersome when they brought out copper Heat exchangers and things became more tricky with a requirement for OH stats hi- lo stats and pump over-runs Thorn apollo was a typical example, These new extra bits caused more problems along with the increased trouble from diverter valves with the advent of fully pumped systems. Apart from the apollos great appetite for pilot burners more expensive thermocouple and basic electronics I still spent a week or 2 every September walking about with a hammer tapping pumps to get them going again after a summer of rest. A little work came from people tampering with the bypass causing the thing to kettle alarmingly.
Up to this point everything was easily manageable until one day it was decided that by forcing the air flow through the boiler that the flue size could be reduced to 100mm. This added a fan and a control pcb to the list of things that could go wrong. The apollo fanfare was now becoming a pain in the butt! Potterton netaheats followed by profiles were the order of the day. Combis soon made their way across the North Sea and suddenly everyone was fitting SD 623's with the well to do opting for a Worcester or a Vaillant. The latter 2 of those would rarely go wrong meanwhile I got a bit handy at sorting out SD's. Strangely the trade price for everything that would go wrong was £120+vat. I fitted my first combi in 1985. A glow worm hot water express. This was not a nice experience as it was faulty from the start. It was chosen for its size.... It would fit in the guys kitchen wall unit. From that day to this I haven't fitted another Glow-worm!
Into the nineties the choice of boiler was becoming a bit of a meme still. I would ask at the merchants what they were selling most of and after a very short stop with the Myson Midas everyone was fitting Ferroli's. Apart from fitting a VMF6.1 or VMF7 pcb now and then these were a quite reliable boiler. The modern ones are still eating expensive pcbs along with a side dressing of thermistors and timeclocks.
Baxi were lagging behind in the boiler stakes and went to Chaffoteaux asking if they could sell their boilers with a Baxi badge The French said Oui Monsieur and the Baxi Genesis was born. Ever since we have been swapping flow switches and pcb's 2 at a time on them.
Potterton Lynx's evolved into puma's and with the Po/xi merger a fixable Baxi combi 80 improved their reputation a little.
Meanwhile everyone else was getting their foot in the door. Biasi, Halstead, Sime Vokera etc. Louis Pickersgill was selling his Ravenheat RSF 820/20s to Scottish gas and B&Q.
While Baxi were trying to get their act together they created another monstrosity the Bahama. Apart from the difficult to get at flow switch they were easy to fix its just that everything needed fixing! Potterton too were getting their act together and if it wasn't for their big mistake with the PCB's they would have had a great boiler in the suprima.
In anticipation of and due to the 98 Kyoto summit manufacturers had something else to contend with. It was getting out of fashion to waste gas running a pilot light thus making electronic ignition the next progression. It was also necessary to have fully modulating burners to provide safer temperature control for showers fitted to combi's So into the noughties the manufacturers developed their own systems with the electronics getting ever more complicated. More mergers went on and with most of the parts being made in Italy you can open up lots of boilers and find the same parts in them. Often these have slight differences so that you can not use a part from one boiler on another.
Things are now such that you cannot differentiate a lot of boilers on anything other than their internal pipework, casings, electronics and badge. Rip any five year old boiler apart and you will find at least a few of the following.
A Giannoni diverter and heat exchanger
Graslin timer, common amongst older biasi, baxi ferroli worcester vokera and Ravenheat
Caleffi PRV
Honeywell SIT or Dungs gas valve
Grundfoss or Wilo pump
Bray burners are now part of Giannoni
Zilmet seem to make most of the pressure vessels
Fugas make the brass hydroblocks

Another factor is that so many firms are up to the VW, Audi Skoda con.
Basically the same item with a few minor differences and a different badge.
Heres the associations that I know of.
C&M, Ariston
Potterton Baxi Main
Saunier Duval, Glow worm, Vokera, Jaguar, Protherm
Worcester, Buderus
Ideal, Biasi

Ravenheat is also another part of the Riello group of companies along with Vokera and I think Baxi.

WTF is going on! They are all peeing in the same pot! All different facets of a great monopoly if you ask me.

Rant over now I'll try and focus on the question for which I can only base my opinion on boilers that I have fitted and walked away from without a problem. Well most of them, and thats because I take care to follow the instructions and do the job right.
What have I fitted?
Well my sisters ferroli I fitted in 1993 is still going strong even though I cant be arsed going round to change the PV and PRV which has been leaking for years. The mother outlaws SD thelia circa 1992 just after I divorced her daughter still bops away even though it has had a few flow switch diaphragms and I had to solder a few dry joints on the PCB once. Oh yes its had a new timer as well. I know of a WM 40 RS which was still doing well since I fitted it in 1987 for a workmate. A second hand VCW 242 was working for 7 years before I took it off the wall prior to demolition a couple of months ago. Since then I have fitted loads of Ravenheats without problem apart from 2. One was a slight adjustment needed to the flame sensor and the other was an LS80. Ravenheats thorn in their side! Biasi's I have fitted have had problems with the timers. I fitted a lot of Baxi 80e and 105e's and they are starting to get their usual problems although the parts are cheaper. Amazingly the heatline vizos I have fitted have been great so far but who knows what problems are likely to develop in future? I fitted one worcester boiler about three years ago which would have been fine if I hadn't trashed the sensing electrode when servicing it. Others are a couple of ferroli... F28's I think, A platinum and lastly a duotec that I commissioned on Thursday

The short answer to the best boiler question is that its the luck of the draw so long as the system is right. They are all rigorously tested [UK ones at Loughborough] before they can be deemed fit for sale. All manufacturers now have to put up with more demanding standards for safety and efficiency

I do like Ravenheats except the LS series because they are the only manufacturers to attain band A rating with an atmospheric burner, they are as British as you can get by way of a boiler, They have the ISO standard and they are a progressive company.

After that I go for baxi as their parts are always available followed by ferroli then heatline. It's fair to point out that often I have no choice and often a cheapy is the best for the job in an environment where landlords want to reduce costs and the impact of a potential boiler theft. I like Vokeras new pre-mix boilers and would like to fit one if the opportunity occurs.

The reason I end up fixing Ravenheats a lot is that its what the landlords monkeys have been fitting over the past few years. They are just as fixable as any other boiler when you know their weak spots and quirks.

Apologies for the essay but its at least part of what I had to say and thats just how it came out of my brain :LOL:
 

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