DIYnot
Local | Network
   DIYnot > Forums
Local | Network
DIYnot Network Local DIYnot Network Local  
  Forum IndexForum Index     RulesRules    HelpHelp     Join FREERegister Free     About CookiesCookies     SearchSearch     LoginLogin 

Do i need to fit a surrey flange for my shower pump?

Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    DIYnot.com Forum Index > Plumbing and Central Heating
Search this topic :: View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:11 pm Reply with quote

I'm just about to start installing a salamdander RSP50 shower pump and wondered if i do actually need to install a surrey flange in the top of the hot water cylinder.

I understand that its there to take water from just below the aerated section at the top of the tank, but do i really need one?

I've got the space and easy access to fit one, just wondering if i need to bother.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators

If you do not want to see this advert, click here to login or if you are new click here to join free.
swidders

from United Kingdom

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 1410
Location: Manchester,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:14 pm Reply with quote

There should be no aerated area at the top of the cylinder - that's what the vent pipe is for.

Yes, you should fit it.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Malc C

from United Kingdom

Joined: 19 Oct 2007
Posts: 117
Location: Hertfordshire,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:40 pm Reply with quote

I suggest you fit the pump as per the instructions, ie seperate cold feed from the cold water storage tank, and use a surrey or essex flange to draw off the hot water. If you tee into the cold feed from the tank that also feeds the HW cylinder you might also run into problems in that the draw off by the pump reduces the amount of water to the cylinder and then you could end up with air being formed at the top of the cylinder because the pump is emptying the cylinder faster than gravity can fill it. -

Might get some of the pro's arguing the toss on that, but that's what happened to me when I first installed my pump off the same cold feed.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
swidders

from United Kingdom

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 1410
Location: Manchester,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:44 pm Reply with quote

Malc C wrote:
I suggest you fit the pump as per the instructions, ie seperate cold feed from the cold water storage tank, and use a surrey or essex flange to draw off the hot water. If you tee into the cold feed from the tank that also feeds the HW cylinder you might also run into problems in that the draw off by the pump reduces the amount of water to the cylinder and then you could end up with air being formed at the top of the cylinder because the pump is emptying the cylinder faster than gravity can fill it. -



... and henceforth sucking air into the pump. Brrr, suddenly cold shower and running a pump dry which may cause damage to it.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Bambergaspipe

from United Kingdom

Joined: 09 May 2007
Posts: 884
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:52 pm Reply with quote

Quote:
if i do actually need to install a surrey flange in the top of the hot water cylinder
.

Some naughty plumbers just tee off the hot water supply to the pump from the top of the cylinder making sure that this is a dedicated feed and then take the remaining hot water supply requirements by teežng in above this...........SHOCKING..
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:54 pm Reply with quote

Malc C wrote:
I suggest you fit the pump as per the instructions, ie seperate cold feed from the cold water storage tank, and use a surrey or essex flange to draw off the hot water. If you tee into the cold feed from the tank that also feeds the HW cylinder you might also run into problems in that the draw off by the pump reduces the amount of water to the cylinder and then you could end up with air being formed at the top of the cylinder because the pump is emptying the cylinder faster than gravity can fill it. -

Might get some of the pro's arguing the toss on that, but that's what happened to me when I first installed my pump off the same cold feed.


That bit i've got covered. The existing cold water tank wasn't big enough and i'm in the process of fitting a new 50 gallon tank so its dead easy to fit a second take off from the tank for a dedicated cold feed which is what i'm doing.

My query is whether i need the surrey flange. I already have a decent angled take off from the top of the hot water tank that i can tee off for the hot water feed, or i can fit the surrey flange but i'm trying to find out if the surrey flange is critical or not.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
swidders

from United Kingdom

Joined: 19 Jan 2009
Posts: 1410
Location: Manchester,
United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 8:57 pm Reply with quote

How much extra work is it to follow the MI?
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
gas4you

from United Kingdom

Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 17630
Location: Norfolk,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 756 times

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:00 pm Reply with quote

Fit the Surrey flange. You'll regret it if you don't. If it's too hard to remove, then fit an essex flange instead.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Bambergaspipe

from United Kingdom

Joined: 09 May 2007
Posts: 884
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:12 pm Reply with quote

gas4you wrote:
Fit the Surrey flange. You'll regret it if you don't. If it's too hard to remove, then fit an essex flange instead.


Failing that try a Norwich or Wembley, if you`re outta luck there try a Basingstoke or Bangor flange. I swear by a Slough. or Didcup, my uncle who has one eye and a speech impediment swears by a Wellingborough.
he swore by a vicar once and was arrested but that`s another story.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:11 am Reply with quote

It's a fairly old hot water tank and the current installation is tidy so i'd rather not disturb it if possible.

But the manufacturers instructions states 'the best connection from the cylinder is either a Salamander S flange or a 3/4" no stop essex flange'. It doesn't stay its mandatory and hence my question as to whether it's necessary.

swidders wrote:
How much extra work is it to follow the MI?
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Richard C

from United Kingdom

Joined: 26 Apr 2005
Posts: 10589
Location: United Kingdom
Thanked: 990 times

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 9:36 am Reply with quote

Fit a side entry Essex flange if you possibly can; this is the preferred method from Salamander & many others. If not, fit a top entry Salamander or Surrey flange. You could try teeing off the bottom of a 45 degree top entry angled vent but Salamander only recommend this fort their CT & NP pumps, they donít actually recommend it for the RSP. Personally, I canít see why it shouldnít work just as well but itís probably best to go with the MIís; do it properly while you can, itís better that having to drain the whole bloody lot down again because of problems or, even worse, after youíve fried the pump!
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:20 am Reply with quote

Surrey flange has been ordered and i'll fit that based on the advice given here.

Thanks all!

Next question.

What type of filter should i fit in line with the feeds to the pump?

Can't find anything on screwfix but the salamander installation manual says that i need an in line strainer.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Richard C

from United Kingdom

Joined: 26 Apr 2005
Posts: 10589
Location: United Kingdom
Thanked: 990 times

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:03 pm Reply with quote

I thought Salamanders came with Stainless steel mesh filter/strainers (2) in the box along with the flexible connectors! They usually just fit into the end of the connector, have you checked they arenít hiding in 2 of the flexis already!
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:16 pm Reply with quote

I shall check the box when i get home tonight!

Thanks.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Lower

from United Kingdom

Joined: 22 Dec 2005
Posts: 535
Location: Leicestershire,
United Kingdom
Thanked: 26 times

PostPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:41 am Reply with quote

Mesh strainers are indeed included inside the box!

Problem solved.
Back to top
 Alert Moderators
Search this topic :: View previous topic :: View next topic  
Post new topic   Reply to topic    DIYnot.com Forum Index > Plumbing and Central Heating All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Similar Topics   Replies   Views   Posted 
Low Pressure from Surrey Flange to Power Shower 12 2420 Sun Nov 19, 2006 7:24 pm
SURREY FLANGE-HOT WATER FOR SHOWER 3 1180 Thu Mar 06, 2008 2:18 pm
Shower fed from a Surrey Flange, anti-gravity loop? 2 1260 Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:27 pm
Surrey or Essex Flange? 8 820 Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:35 pm
fitting a surrey flange 7 520 Mon Feb 01, 2010 11:16 pm


 
DIYnot
Find an Expert | Find a Supplier | Search DIYnot.com
Network | Advertising | Newsletter
DIY | DIY How To | @home | DIY Wiki | DIY Forum
By using this site you agree to our Terms of Service / Disclaimer.
Please read our Privacy Policy. Copyright © 2000-2014 DIYnot Limited.