Of course Ive got a Co2 alarm. (just to emphasize a point) its been a waste of money and batteries up to now
Do bottled gas room heaters have catalysts?
Do bottled gas room heaters have catalysts?
flueless gas fires
- Thread starter mdaz71
- Start date
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Unless you have studied combustion issues then its understandable that you will not know much about it.
A cooker is a simple burner which is designed to burn correctly under any difficult conditions with a nice blue flame.
Some fires are actually designed to have a nice orange flame and produce monoxide in the hope that the catalyst will oxidise that to dioxide.
Without careful setup and regular servicing there is no guarantee that the combustion conditions will remain in spec or that the catalyst will continue to work efficiently.
Have you never heard of poisoned catalysts?
Tony
Transam
1-was. 2-no. retired
Agile
Yes - poisoned catalysts occur in motor vehicles when the incorrect fuel (lead ) is burned. Or when the engine is badly worn/tuned or damaged allowing other chemicals such as manganese, silicon or zinc to coat the catalyst. They do not become contamineted from burning methane gas.
Why do we in Britain hang on to these urban myths about this product
USA- In 18 yers 18,000,000 installed.up to 2008
Japan- -----------40,000,000 installed. ditto
Both with exemplary safety records
Come on you luddites, wake up, the world is passing you by, warm your house not the sky.
1-was. 2-no. retired
Agile
Yes - poisoned catalysts occur in motor vehicles when the incorrect fuel (lead ) is burned. Or when the engine is badly worn/tuned or damaged allowing other chemicals such as manganese, silicon or zinc to coat the catalyst. They do not become contamineted from burning methane gas.
Why do we in Britain hang on to these urban myths about this product
USA- In 18 yers 18,000,000 installed.up to 2008
Japan- -----------40,000,000 installed. ditto
Both with exemplary safety records
Come on you luddites, wake up, the world is passing you by, warm your house not the sky.
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If you imagine they are so safe without correct installation and annual servicing then how do you explain how the 14 y.o. girl was killed by one a year ago?
Do you really think that just because YOU dont think that a catalyst in a fire never becomes poisoned they are totally safe without being checked with a gas analyser? Have you considered that the combustion conditions might have changed? Suppose the catalyst became sooted up then do you still think it would work properly? Or could it kill someone? Get real !
I suppose you have never owned or used a flue gas analyser?
Your comments seem to me to be dangerous and not what should be published on this site.
Tony
Do you really think that just because YOU dont think that a catalyst in a fire never becomes poisoned they are totally safe without being checked with a gas analyser? Have you considered that the combustion conditions might have changed? Suppose the catalyst became sooted up then do you still think it would work properly? Or could it kill someone? Get real !
I suppose you have never owned or used a flue gas analyser?
Your comments seem to me to be dangerous and not what should be published on this site.
Tony
Would be grateful if you would point to where I said these appliances should not be correctly installed or serviced as per M.I. ie with gas analyser.
Ive got one.
Which comments are dangrous?
------------------------------------------
Corgi Reg installer---Retired
Ive got one.
Which comments are dangrous?
------------------------------------------
Corgi Reg installer---Retired
It is dangerous to say that catalysts do not fail on a public forum
Its the failure of the cat which killed that girl.
If you will not accept that then would you care to explain exactly how she was killed?
Unfortunately people reading this forum have no idea who is giving the correct advice and some may mistakenly think that what you say is true.
Tony
dont know the case you refer to. can you point me to where I can read the findings. Did the catalyst fail or was it incorrectly installed as you seem to point out in your previous post
All practicising gas engineers will be aware of the case!
Thats why most, including British Gas, will not risk get involved with them.
The fire was correctly installed but was not properly commissioned so a manufacturer's failure to set the gas rate at the appropriate figure was not detected and incomplete combustion poisoned the catalyst and produced monoxide which killed the girl and her dog.
Then you go and say catalysts in fires dont get poisoned !
Tony
Thats why most, including British Gas, will not risk get involved with them.
The fire was correctly installed but was not properly commissioned so a manufacturer's failure to set the gas rate at the appropriate figure was not detected and incomplete combustion poisoned the catalyst and produced monoxide which killed the girl and her dog.
Then you go and say catalysts in fires dont get poisoned !
Tony
agile is this one where the they put lpg injectors in fire
As far as I can gather the range of adjustment available was so wide that it was somehow possible to set it dangerously high.
The setting was sealed against movement in transit with varnish. This will discourage some RGIs from correctly setting it.
The RGI who installed it failed to gas rate it which is VERY important to ensure the catalyst can adequate oxidise the monoxide.
As usual the manufacturers failings were rather hushed up and all the blame was heaped on the installer. Thats was worse because he was not registered to work on gas fires.
At the end of the day it was his responsibility to properly commission the fire and ensure it was correctly set to work safely.
Hopefully this will have been a sobering lesson for all RGIs. Pity retired RGIs who post their ( flawed ) views on forums have not kept up to date with these important safety issues.
Tony
The setting was sealed against movement in transit with varnish. This will discourage some RGIs from correctly setting it.
The RGI who installed it failed to gas rate it which is VERY important to ensure the catalyst can adequate oxidise the monoxide.
As usual the manufacturers failings were rather hushed up and all the blame was heaped on the installer. Thats was worse because he was not registered to work on gas fires.
At the end of the day it was his responsibility to properly commission the fire and ensure it was correctly set to work safely.
Hopefully this will have been a sobering lesson for all RGIs. Pity retired RGIs who post their ( flawed ) views on forums have not kept up to date with these important safety issues.
Tony
Found it! Newport 6 Oct 2006
Tragic death as a direct consequence of incompetant installer, failing to ensure correct installation.
Any appliance incorrectly installed is potentialy lethal. Just trawl through the HSE incidents with flued fires
Tragic death as a direct consequence of incompetant installer, failing to ensure correct installation.
Any appliance incorrectly installed is potentialy lethal. Just trawl through the HSE incidents with flued fires
N
namsag
Agile i hope you realise whhat you have wrote is libelous as it was not the cat that failed it was a mixture of fire being grossly overgassed and a vent in just such a position that the draught kept the oxypilot from dropping out as the oxygen was used up in the room .
Why is it dangerous to say cats dont fail on a public forum, when it is stipulated on the manufacturers web site and somehow i think they know more than you tregards this
put a link to where it said the cat failed due to being over gassed.[/code]
Why is it dangerous to say cats dont fail on a public forum, when it is stipulated on the manufacturers web site and somehow i think they know more than you tregards this
put a link to where it said the cat failed due to being over gassed.[/code]
Burley's litterature claims to have tested its cats under the most extreme conditions by spraying a variety of household liquids on them. They say they have tested them in operation for the equivelant of 30 years (I dont know how they do it) then removed them and sent them back to the manufacturers for assessment, who found that they were as good as the day they were made
N
namsag
Just another example of Agile thinking he knows what he is talking about ,usually at this stage he makes up some weird sounding chemical compound to majke it more convincing but in reality it doesnt even exist.
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