Wiring into a newly built porch?

Ian H · 15 Sep 2010

I'm in the process of building a porch, its small enough not to need planning permission etc... so i'm thinking of doing the electrics myself.

Is it possible to DIY it? I'd be wanting a light with 2 switch's and a double socket (Maybe an outside light as well). The consumer unit is immediatly behind the porch and has unused circuit breakers.

Where would I statrt or is it not advisable? I've previously only ever re wired a car but would be 100% confident I could follow instructions to do the porch.

Thanks in advance.

ban-all-sheds · 15 Sep 2010

1990 said:
I'm in the process of building a porch, its small enough not to need planning permission etc... so i'm thinking of doing the electrics myself.

//www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:part-p

Is it possible to DIY it? I'd be wanting a light with 2 switch's and a double socket (Maybe an outside light as well). The consumer unit is immediatly behind the porch and has unused circuit breakers.

Where would I statrt or is it not advisable? I've previously only ever re wired a car but would be 100% confident I could follow instructions to do the porch.

IMO you should never do electrical work by just following instructions - a full understanding of everything you're doing is essential.

Richard C · 15 Sep 2010

If they meet certain criteria (size is one) you don’t need PP for a porch; if it meets certain criteria, again, you don’t need to comply with Building Regs. However this does not include electrics which must still comply with Building Regs Part P & the use of safety glass in critical locations.

If your inexperienced & given that you’ve only done car electrics before, you should not attempt to "muddle through", it’s not advisable.

Ian H · 15 Sep 2010

OK, thanks, plenty of food for thought there. I'll let you know what I end up doing (unless I die a horrible death by electrocution).

Steve · 15 Sep 2010

1990, ignore ban's sledgehammer approach to his dislike of DIY work - he's a DIYer himself, as am I.

Now, fitting a socket - you could spur off a socket in the house, or use a spare MCB - only a 16 amp one would be required.

The lights could be spurred off the socket if its on its own breaker - use an FCU to feed the lights - OR take a feed from a ceiling rose in the house.

You should RCD protect any new plaster-hidden wiring.

ban-all-sheds · 15 Sep 2010

Steve said:
1990, ignore ban's sledgehammer approach to his dislike of DIY work - he's a DIYer himself, as am I.

I look forward to reading your explanation of why DIYers don't need to do things properly.

Of particular interest will be your reasons why when DIYers install new circuits they don't have to know anything about sizing cables, getting the MCB ratings right and why no matter how they install cables their current carrying capacity remains the same, and why their cables have zero resistance thus making voltage drop and fault loop impedance a non-issue for them.

Steve · 15 Sep 2010

He's running a cable from an MCB to a socket about 4 feet away!

Volt drop wont be an issue. It probably wont be in insulation. It wont be very long.

I just think you over complicate things ban.

ban-all-sheds · 15 Sep 2010

Give a man a fish....

Ian H · 15 Sep 2010

Steve, thanks for an easy to understand answer. I'll text Stephen Hawkins and tell him I wont need a hand after all

I do have the hall lights very close and also a socket very close too.

I have 3 empty spaces on the consumer unit, one on the RCD side that also has upstairs sockets, downstairs sockets, loft and cooker. Then 2 on the other side which has upstairs lights, downstairs lights and burglar alarm.

I think it would it be neater and easier to feed a socket from the existing socket and the lights from the hall lights. Would the aditional socket trip the ring main's RCD that I spur'd it from? Thanks again

Ban, I have DIY alsorts at home, my only mistake/thing not done properly was when I dot and dab'd foil backed plasterboard in my kitchen extension, ha ha!!!

1john · 15 Sep 2010

So you are going to bury cables from the existing lighting circuit and they wont be protected by an RCD so won't comply?

btw, foil backed boards and dot and dab - we all learn the hard way

Taylortwocities · 15 Sep 2010

Do look at BAS's PArt P link and especially the type of work that is notifiable.

In your case:

You must notify the local authority if you add new circuits to the spare spaces in your consumer unit.

You do not have to notify if the connections to the sockets & lights are run as extensions from existing circuits.

Steve's (5:42) post gives you a reasonable guide, IMO.

Richard C · 16 Sep 2010

1990 said:
I have DIY alsorts at home, my only mistake/thing not done properly was when I dot and dab'd foil backed plasterboard in my kitchen extension, ha ha!!!

Well I could have told you not to do that

; When doing most unfamiliar things in life it always pays to ask questions & research it thoroughly before you start! Fixing plasterboard incorrectly means it will just fall off the wall; wiring a circuit incorrectly or failing to follow recognised installation/testing procedures could actually kill you!

Ian H · 16 Sep 2010

1john said:
So you are going to bury cables from the existing lighting circuit and they wont be protected by an RCD so won't comply?

btw, foil backed boards and dot and dab - we all learn the hard way

Do you mean bury them under the new plaster? Yes the wire to the switch would be. Is the danger there incase I ever hit the wire with a nail?

What if I extended the ring main to give me the extra socket, then spur off that for the lights? Would the lights then be RCD protected? Would it also be leagal for me to do it without notification?

I'm slowly learning, thanks very much. If I do kill myself it may be for the best.

Taylortwocities · 16 Sep 2010

1990 said:
Do you mean bury them under the new plaster? Yes the wire to the switch would be. Is the danger there incase I ever hit the wire with a nail?

Yes, exactly. And it is not just you because you will know where the cable is. Cabling can last several decades and you may sell the house to someone else, that's why the RCD requirement has been introduced.

1990 said:
What if I extended the ring main to give me the extra socket, then spur off that for the lights? Would the lights then be RCD protected? Would it also be leagal for me to do it without notification?

Yes that would do it. You cannot just "spur" off the ring though, you will need to provide a fused connection unit with a 3amp fuse (suitable for lighting).

Yes, it is legal, per my post above. Adding to existing circuits is not notifiable and an indoor porch is not a special location.

Ian H · 16 Sep 2010

Excellent!! Thanks very much for the advice.

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Wiring into a newly built porch?

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