Controlling my heating and hot water?

farazfastian · 19 Jul 2011

We had horrible winters last year moved to the new house, found it gets cold very quickly and still end up paying very high gas bills. I've to sort this out fully before winter and according to my research I think I’ve to do following:

1) Insulate Loft: because I noticed upstairs gets cold before downstairs (will cover this in a separate thread)

2) Control Heating

It's a worcester (i think its greenstar 24Ri) boiler fitted couple of years ago located in the kitchen with two tanks in the loft and cylinder in the airing cupboard. There's no display on the boiler it has just a knob to control burner I believe and there's no temperature marks on it. Old style manual programmer is in the airing cupboard upstairs where you can set just two durations to turn on the heating which works for both hot water and heating which is very annoying.

All i need is a room thermostat to control temperature so that we don't have to worry about turning the heater on/off and also the programmer where i can program heating/hot water separately with multiple durations.

I'm thinking to get a digital programmer with thermostat in it to be fit in the airing cupboard, i believe this would do everything or do I’ve to get separate programmer and separate thermostat to this job? Also is it a big job or any plumber can do it?

Many Thanks
Faraz

D_Hailsham · 19 Jul 2011

farazfastian said:
1) Insulate Loft: because I noticed upstairs gets cold before downstairs (will cover this in a separate thread)

Also do the walls if they are cavity type.

Check out Energy Savings Trust Grant Search for low-cost and free insulation offers.

Keep the old programmer in the airing cupboard to control HW times. Two durations a day should be sufficient and people rarely change the times the hot water is ON. Presumably the timer has an override button, so you can turn the HW on out of sequence if necessary.

Use a 7-day programmable thermostat for the heating, e.g Honeywell CM907.

Not all plumbers do electrics and many electricians are unfamiliar with heating controls. If you have done any electrical work in the past you should be able to do the work yourself - with our help.

DP · 19 Jul 2011

Keep the existing timer for HW control. Fit a programmable room thermostat to bring on the heating according to frost control, presence in the house but you are active, and thirdly, when sitting down/ reading a book/ watching television etc.

The programmable roomstat looks at the ambient temperature and fires the boiler if programmed setting exceeds ambient temperature.

craig51 · 19 Jul 2011

Or if you dont want to faff with wiring the room stat, you can fit trvs to the rads if they already dont have some. Then each room can be controlled as required. Also with it drained down, you can add inhibitor too.

Or do both, room stat and trvs!

Cover hot tank if you already havnt, or it has no foam

Cavity/loft insulation

Get the boiler serviced to ensure coorect burner pressures etc.

D_Hailsham · 19 Jul 2011

craig51 said:
Or if you dont want to faff with wiring the room stat, you can fit trvs to the rads if they already dont have some. Then each room can be controlled as required. Also with it drained down, you can add inhibitor too.

Or do both, room stat and trvs!

TRVs on their own do not meet Building Regs requirement for a boiler interlock. Although there are other ways of doing this, the easiest is a (programmable) room thermostat.

If you don't want to run long wires from the programmable stat to the junction box/boiler, you can always go wireless.

craig51 · 19 Jul 2011

true, and i never said it did, BUT, IMO if i had to choose between trvs or a thermostat (i have both BTW) then I would do without a r/s and install just trvs. That way the rooms which i only want to be warm are warm, and those cold, err well, cold, without having to wait for the hall to heat up before my boiler kicks off.

dont get me wrong, i'm not anti r/s, just think they are not the best for saving money when compared to trvs IMHumbleO

farazfastian · 20 Jul 2011

Thanks for the replies, let me clear few things:

- don't have cavity walls so can't do anything with the walls

- did check energy saving trust website but looks like i'm not eligible as i'm not taking any benefit

- TRVs are already there and normally i keep them set according to weather and changes only when i need to

- I can keep the old programmer but i've noticed some time it doesn't kick-off so not sure if its worth keeping

- I think wireless thermostat will suite me, is there a one which can program HW and CH separately and also act as a thermostate or better to go separate?

My major worry at the moment who to get this job done, as i've to do following and i believe i need different skills for each:

- Raise of Joist
- Loft Insulation
- Fitting of floor boards
- Installation of thermostat and Programmer
- Needs to check the whole heating system or may be flushing is required too

Many Thanks
Faraz

D_Hailsham · 20 Jul 2011

farazfastian said:
did check energy saving trust website but looks like i'm not eligible as i'm not taking any benefit.

You don't always need to be on benefits to get low cost insulation. For example: any one over 70 is now entitled to free cavity wall and loft insulation. Energy suppliers also have low cost schemes as they are being encouraged by the government to do this.

TRVs are already there and normally i keep them set according to weather and changes only when i need to

There should not be any need to change a TRV setting. The whole idea of them is that they maintain a constant temperature in the room.

I can keep the old programmer but i've noticed some time it doesn't kick-off so not sure if its worth keeping.

Good point.

I think wireless thermostat will suite me, is there a one which can program HW and CH separately and also act as a thermostate or better to go separate?

Have a look at the Honeywell Sundial RF² Wireless Enabled Kits. There are three versions and one should be suitable.

bengasman · 20 Jul 2011

farazfastian said:
- TRVs are already there and normally i keep them set according to weather and changes only when i need to

There is no need to change trv settings with change of weather as outside temp does not change the desired temperature indoors.

farazfastian · 21 Jul 2011

Honeywell Rf2 programmer pack 3 looking great, i couldn't find any reviews of it is there any alternate product to it or it is the best in market?

Many Thanks

D_Hailsham · 21 Jul 2011

farazfastian said:
Honeywell Rf2 programmer pack 3 looking great, i couldn't find any reviews of it is there any alternate product to it or it is the best in market?

It is a new product, but is based on existing reliable Honeywell technology.

It is also on the expensive side (up to £200!) That's because it is wireless for both heating and hot water. The combined timer and receiver side still has to be wired in; it's only the two thermostats which are wireless.

The heating side could be covered by a CM927 (Ebay £80) and the hot water by a ST9100C 7 day timer (Ebay £39) situated in the airing cupboard. This will allow you to have three hot water periods a day and has a 1 hour boost button.

The only advantage of the Pack 3 is that the CH and HW times are controlled from the same place. But how often do you need to adjust the HW times?

farazfastian · 5 Aug 2011

I've got wired thermostat already installed on the cylinder, so i think i just need Pack 2 which is £130 and the installer is charging £80.

Just wana know do i've to look in to any specific details in my heating system to make sure Pack 2 will work fully?

Another thing will it read the temperature from cylinder thermostate to kick of boiler for hot water? or boiler can only work on 3 programs?

Many Thanks
Faraz

farazfastian · 18 Oct 2011

Hi guys,

Finally I got Honeywell sundial 2 installed and it's working fine according to set program but if hot water run out it doesn't kick-off boiler and we end up getting cold water then I've to manually turn the programmer to Continous position, please advise what could w wrong?

Regards,
Faraz

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Controlling my heating and hot water?

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