New boiler installed on an old system. Bodged job? PICS

sarahjones1975 · 12 Jan 2012

Hi,

My parents have just had a new boiler installed on an existing 10 year old system. The old boiler has been non functional for a approx 9 months. The new boiler has been installed by [EDITED]. This is what he did in around 5 hours:-

1) drained the old system from the cellar. He did not open all the radiators TRV's whilst draining.
2) disconnected and removed the old boiler
3) installed new boiler (he had to add additional lengths of copper pipe (gas supply, water in/out and central heating flow and return) as this new boiler is smaller and therefore mounted a little higher than the old boiler.
4) Filled system with water and added inhibitor.

All this took him around 5 hours.

I was told that a powerflush would be done before install, but it didn't happen.

What is the proper step by step procedure to fit a new boiler onto an existing system?

Thanks

muggles · 12 Jan 2012

It's been done by Warmfront, don't expect miracles, you've got what you've paid for (or rather, haven't paid for). Pay peanuts, get monkeys

Dan Robinson · 12 Jan 2012

Good job you didn't pay for any of it then

sarahjones1975 · 12 Jan 2012

We have had to make a £450 'contribution' so please could you post what should have been done, so that I can get them to put it right.

mr-crs · 12 Jan 2012

Without seeing the job its difficult to advise, it may be that the system was clean and did not require power flushing. Its normal practice for the warm front installer to fit a system filter did he do this? All warm front installations are quality checked post installation you should raise your concerns then, hope this helps Paul.

arfurrrr · 12 Jan 2012

I don't like warm front . one of my customers was ripped off . Post some more details up and piccys if you can . Are your parents in Leeds ? If so what area .

sarahjones1975 · 12 Jan 2012

mr-crs said:
Without seeing the job its difficult to advise, it may be that the system was clean and did not require power flushing. Its normal practice for the warm front installer to fit a system filter did he do this? All warm front installations are quality checked post installation you should raise your concerns then, hope this helps Paul.

a scale inhibitor deviice and a spirovent were fitted to the system, is this enough or should the system have been power flushed? it is arouned 10 years old and some raditors don't heat up fully.

sarahjones1975 · 12 Jan 2012

arfurrrr said:
I don't like warm front . one of my customers was ripped off . Post some more details up and piccys if you can . Are your parents in Leeds ? If so what area .

Won't have pics until friday/sat, it looks neat enough as the boiler was a straight swap and I'm not too fussed about that. I just want it to work and be reliable and I've read that the main thing is not the quality of the boiler but the quality of the install. The install was just as i described. The existing boiler had gone kaput 9 months ago. He just drained the existing water. After that he took the boiler off. Put the new one on, fitted it to the extended pipes and filled it up. He fired up the boiler and left. I didn't see him do any flushes at all.

He's written on the benchmark sheet that F3 has been used to cleanse but I didn't see him do this and I don't understand how he could cleansed it using this without using something to circulate is around as the boiler was not working.

My main concern is that if there was any rubbish in the system, it will now already be in the heat exchanger. Something similar has happened to my boiler which was not flushed properly and I've had to replace the pump so far.

The ideal installation manual says "If the boiler is installed in an existing system any unsuitable additives MUST be removed by thorough cleansing. BS 7593:2006 details the steps necessary to clean a domestic heating system." ..."Under no circumstances should the boiler be fired before the system has been thoroughly flushed."

PS: my parents are in halifax (where the boiler is), I'm closer to Leeds

dcawkwell · 12 Jan 2012

sarahjones1975 said:
Hi,

My parents have just had a new boiler installed on an existing 10 year old system. The old boiler has been non functional for a approx 9 months. The new boiler has been installed by warm front. This is what he did in around 5 hours:-

1) drained the old system from the cellar. He did not open all the radiators TRV's whilst draining.
2) disconnected and removed the old boiler
3) installed new boiler (he had to add additional lengths of copper pipe (gas supply, water in/out and central heating flow and return) as this new boiler is smaller and therefore mounted a little higher than the old boiler.
4) Filled system with water and added inhibitor.

All this took him around 5 hours.

I was told that a powerflush would be done before install, but it didn't happen.

What is the proper step by step procedure to fit a new boiler onto an existing system?

Thanks

Warmfront be glad of what they got. If they don't like it buy their own
boiler.

sarahjones1975 · 12 Jan 2012

dcawkwell said:
sarahjones1975 said:

Hi,

My parents have just had a new boiler installed on an existing 10 year old system. The old boiler has been non functional for a approx 9 months. The new boiler has been installed by warm front. This is what he did in around 5 hours:-

1) drained the old system from the cellar. He did not open all the radiators TRV's whilst draining.
2) disconnected and removed the old boiler
3) installed new boiler (he had to add additional lengths of copper pipe (gas supply, water in/out and central heating flow and return) as this new boiler is smaller and therefore mounted a little higher than the old boiler.
4) Filled system with water and added inhibitor.

All this took him around 5 hours.

I was told that a powerflush would be done before install, but it didn't happen.

What is the proper step by step procedure to fit a new boiler onto an existing system?

Thanks

Click to expand...

Warmfront be glad of what they got. If they don't like it buy their own
boiler.

Like I said they made a significant contribution to the cost of just a replacement boiler. If they had paid for the entire install how would it have been better?

CAN WE LEAVE THE WARMFRONT ISSUE OUT OF THIS.

I just need a step by step guide as to what should have been done so I can challenge the installer and report this guy to Warmfront.

dcawkwell · 12 Jan 2012

sarahjones1975 said:
dcawkwell said:

sarahjones1975 said:

Hi,

My parents have just had a new boiler installed on an existing 10 year old system. The old boiler has been non functional for a approx 9 months. The new boiler has been installed by warm front. This is what he did in around 5 hours:-

1) drained the old system from the cellar. He did not open all the radiators TRV's whilst draining.
2) disconnected and removed the old boiler
3) installed new boiler (he had to add additional lengths of copper pipe (gas supply, water in/out and central heating flow and return) as this new boiler is smaller and therefore mounted a little higher than the old boiler.
4) Filled system with water and added inhibitor.

All this took him around 5 hours.

I was told that a powerflush would be done before install, but it didn't happen.

What is the proper step by step procedure to fit a new boiler onto an existing system?

Thanks

Click to expand...

Warmfront be glad of what they got. If they don't like it buy their own
boiler.

Click to expand...

Like I said they made a significant contribution to the cost of just a replacement boiler. If they had paid for the entire install how would it have been better?

CAN WE LEAVE THE WARMFRONT ISSUE OUT OF THIS.

I just need a step by step guide as to what should have been done so I can challenge the installer and report this guy to Warmfront.

In my view if the installer ran in the door bolted the a new boiler to
the wall and ran out again they got a bargain for what they paid.
People are just never happy.

muggles · 12 Jan 2012

sarahjones1975 said:
CAN WE LEAVE THE WARMFRONT ISSUE OUT OF THIS.

Err, no, partly because you brought it up in the first place, and mainly because it is relevant. As I said before, pay peanuts get monkeys. If you wanted a better job doing, a local reputable installer should have been called in rather than Warmfront. Your parents have a new boiler that works, for about a quarter of what it would have normally cost, be happy with your lot and pipe down.

Agile · 12 Jan 2012

At my prices they paid just 31.20% of what I would have charged.

That still leaves them with a benefit of £990 which they could use to upgrade the installation if they wished to.

The installation is supposed to have some kind of warranty. On the last one I saw the owners could not be bothered to even send off the warrantee card or to have thee boiler serviced even ONCE during the six years before it failed.

He did not even want to pay me for my diagnosis even though I always make it absolutely clear what we charge before coming. In fact the only way I got paid was to insist on the payment before telling him what the fault was.

There had been a recall on those boilers but because he had not registered the boiler or had it serviced he never found out about it. The cost of repairing would have been about £400 as it was very seriously damaged. ( Ecomax seals ).

Tony

bell824 · 13 Jan 2012

they paid a signifacant amount?? for goodness sake this would be far less half the way to the time cost's to experienced guys or less than half the way to a good boiler,

for £430 and the rest is paid for then you should not be entitled to complain, try asking one the guys that have posted here to come round and check it over and you could easily add £200 or £300 for another commision.

JohnD · 13 Jan 2012

Be fair, the installer has been paid (shared by two parties) and should be expected to do a workmanlike job.

If you go into the NHS for surgery, would you not be entitled to grumble if they cut the wrong leg off, even though you don't pay at point of use? If your house was on fire, would you not be entitled to grumble if the firefighters stayed in their vehicle playing cards instead of getting the hoses out?

Good to hear they've fitted a spirovent, although in my very limited experience it does not trap grime with the spectacular speed of a Magnaclean, at least it shouldn't leak.

I suppose the householder can get an idea of how dirty the system is by seeing what comes out of the Spirovent, and if the rads need bleeding. I have heard it said that Spirovents don't trap dirt loosened by X400, but I don't know how true that is. It is very easy to vent the grime out of a Spiro, after a few minutes instruction or reading the instructions.

If the quote specified that the system would be powerflushed, then the OP is entitled to have had it done, and to complain if it wasn't.

See http://www.fernox.com/problem+solving/how+to+sheets/cleaning+a+central+heating+system for Fernox F3 procedure.

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New boiler installed on an old system. Bodged job? PICS