kitchen wiring

kevin1234 · 18 Dec 2008

hello, could somebody tell me what switches is to be used when wiring and fitting out a kitchen e.g, for your microwave, dishwasher,washing machine, tumble dryer,

is it 13amp switches with neons, 20amp switch, fuse onlys? whats the difference in them and how do you know which 1's to use where cheers

rebuke · 18 Dec 2008

From your question, it would appear you don't know enough about the regulations to successfully wire a kitchen (you are aware that it is notifiable work under Part P of the building regulations I assume). I would strongly suggest you employ a competent person...

DESL · 18 Dec 2008

Location: Caithness,

Part P not applicable

rebuke · 18 Dec 2008

Oops, didn't notice that, my bad

I would still strongly suggest you employ a qualified electrician, as the rest of my post still stands - I would worry as to whether you can do the work safely...

kevin1234 · 19 Dec 2008

well i have just qualified as an electrician,but havent had enough experience in domestic wiring so thats why im asking so any help please

jj4091 · 19 Dec 2008

Kevin, please do not take this the wrong way, but is this for a job that you have been asked to do & are going to be paid for? Because it does not sound as though you have enough experience to be competant to be doing domestic work just yet.

kevin1234 · 22 Dec 2008

well if ur wanting to know i aint planning on doing at all, im just wanting to learn u know, its not as if i am going to be actually doing it, so somebody any help?

sparkyspike · 22 Dec 2008

Generally, any appliance under the counter, or any appliance which blocks access to its power outlet, will need an accessible point of isolation. Usually this means a 13A switched and fused spur (an fcu) and an unswitched socket outlet by the appliance. Don't use double sockets for washing machines etc., use individual fcus and single socket outlets.

For 16A and 20A radials you can use a 20A DP switch with an unswitched socket below. Don't use a 20A DP on a ring.

13A fcus have BS1361 fuses in them which are rated for the appliance. This is what you need to isolate most of your appliances. 20A DP switches have no fuses and switch both live and neutral. Unswitched fcus are only used for stepping down fuse ratings, not for isolation. Useful for security alarms and spurs.

Neons are up to you. You can also get engraved fcus for identifying appliances. These are available as grid switches as well as normal plates.

Depending on the load, you can put some appliances, e.g. a fridge and a freezer, on a double unswitched socket via a 20A DP on a 20A radial.

Keep fridges and high loads on a separate mcb or rcbo.

bongos · 22 Dec 2008

sparkyspike said:
Usually this means a 13A switched and fused spur (an fcu) and an unswitched socket outlet by the appliance.

Is this ever a problem in relation to discrimination, to have a 13A fuse in the FCU and a 13A fuse in the appliance plug?

sparkyspike said:
Don't use a 20A DP on a ring.

Am I right in thinking that you couldn't use grid switches on a ring as they are only rated to 20A? It would have to be (as you say) a 16 or 20A radial?

RF Lighting · 22 Dec 2008

bongos said:
sparkyspike said:

Don't use a 20A DP on a ring.

Click to expand...

Am I right in thinking that you couldn't use grid switches on a ring as they are only rated to 20A? It would have to be (as you say) a 16 or 20A radial?

Have a search for this as opinions differ.

Some say as a RFC is rated to 32A so you can't use 20A rated switches.

Some say that 20A switches are OK as they will not actually be switching more than their rated load.

BS3036 · 22 Dec 2008

bongos said:
Is this ever a problem in relation to discrimination, to have a 13A fuse in the FCU and a 13A fuse in the appliance plug?

I thought the point of discrimination was to stop one fault or overload from causing more than one appliance to stop working. That wouldn't happen in this case.

sparkyspike · 22 Dec 2008

If the appliance uses a fuse lower than 13A, often the lower rated fuse is put in the fcu and a 13A fuse put in the plug top. This helps when having to change a fuse, although you need to mark the plugtop to ensure that if the appliance is moved, the correct fuse is fitted.

bongos · 22 Dec 2008

BS3036 said:
bongos said:

Is this ever a problem in relation to discrimination, to have a 13A fuse in the FCU and a 13A fuse in the appliance plug?

Click to expand...

I thought the point of discrimination was to stop one fault or overload from causing more than one appliance to stop working. That wouldn't happen in this case.

Apologies I may have used the wrong wording! What I meant was that there could be two 13A fuses inline with each other. Not that it would be a real problem if one blew I suppose. Just check one then the other - more that it could be awkward if having to pull appliances out etc.

skenk · 22 Dec 2008

sparkyspike said:
Don't use a 20A DP on a ring.

Why not? It's not as though the terminals in a single 13A socket (or double for that matter) are rated at 32A are they? The whole point of a ring is that the current is drawn around both legs, I don't know the calcs but even a badly loaded ring wouldn't draw more than 20A on one leg would it? (assuming it wasn't broken)

RF Lighting · 22 Dec 2008

They are not specifically listed in BS7671 as an acceptable device to be connected directly to a RFC

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kitchen wiring

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