Am I better off buying the boiler myself?

fatplumber · 20 May 2009

I find that moist customers accept that I make a profit on materials. I also carry the can for when it goes wrong. I'll fit only if I think the client deserves a break. Totally b*ggerd boiler and I can see that they are skint. They can go and get the boiler on a credit card. I cannot give them that kind of service.

bengasman · 20 May 2009

heytesto said:
Absolutely bengasman, but I still advocate that gas appliances and parts should only be available to RGIs...

And it can be done, and already has been done abroad.
It has been my conviction for a long time that there is a conflict of interest between manufacturers/distributors and those responsible for legislation.

B&Q advertising in corgi rag.
Head of ofgas with connections in the oil/gas industry.
Gordon's brother topdog in edf, and what looks suspiciously like filling each others pockets with taxpayer's money.

Sadly I have no proof, but I bet if you dig deep enough, some interesting connections pop up between bg, warmfront and some mp's.
I don't think even the staunchest labour supporter can deny that a lot of mp's have shamelessly taken advantage of the working man despite portraying to work in his interest.

I fear that it will be a long time before cowboys are completely stamped out.
We can't lay all the blame at others though. Too many RGI's are narrow minded and only interested in short term gains, and completely lack any form of vision.

bengasman · 20 May 2009

worto03 said:
I think the main thing that fustrated me with the quote this thread is about was the £2250 quote of which I have no idea how much is labour, how much is parts, how long the job should take, whats involved (even at a basic level), also when I asked to add on the optional extras such as the wireless thermostat and digital timer the quote stayed the same which I thought was odd - is this because his margins were so high anyway he could just fit them and earn a bit less - I dunno?

Compare it to your cisko example.
Would you give the customers a few new pc's for free after you have quoted for the job, when it turns out that would be quite handy for them?

I mean, what is a couple of pc's wholesale on a £300,000 network?
If you try to get in with a company and you know there are others bidding very sharply, do you include rerunning all the cable if it is still in good nick, or do you reuse that?

worto03 · 20 May 2009

I find that moist customers accept that I make a profit on materials.

So you should too. The customer is paying for your recomendation of what boiler will do the job, avoiding shoddy boilers, getting the correct spec boiler for the size of house, your time & knowledge etc etc.

Compare it to your cisko example.
Would you give the customers a few new pc's for free after you have quoted for the job, when it turns out that would be quite handy for them?

I mean, what is a couple of pc's wholesale on a £300,000 network?
If you try to get in with a company and you know there are others bidding very sharply, do you include rerunning all the cable if it is still in good nick, or do you reuse that?

Yeah good point that - I think a lot of it might come down to my lack of experience - it's my first house, my first faulty boiler therefore my first experience of this sort of thing but saying that it doesn't mean I'll just accept the first quote that comes my way without looking into a few things.

bengasman · 20 May 2009

Forgot the most important point, that virtually no home owner is aware of.
If the installer fits a boiler that is supplied by someone else, like the homeowner, he is not liable for warrantee issues.
Any problems would be between you and the vendor/manufacturer.
As the installer would earn less already, AND not have to come out for free when there is a fault, he doesn't have much of an incentive to do the best job possible.
2 brands that are very common in self-supply jobs are heatline and ravenheat; you don't have to browse back very far to find a page on the forum that has a post: "problem with ravenheat xxxx" or " my heatline doesn't work anymore"

Biggles.. · 20 May 2009

OP you have mail.

Agile · 20 May 2009

I quote totally transparent charges for installing a boiler.

I expect to buy it and charge a £10 delivery fee above the actual cost.

So I can happily fit a customers boiler because it makes no difference to be and in the unlikely event it went wrong then I would not have to go out to it first.

Tony

namsag · 20 May 2009

Bengas do you have two standards of work then, one for customers you are making a mint out of and one you are not making as much out of.
I find that a very strange way of working personally i always do what i regard a high standard of work whether i am makin a grand a day/ £200 or if it is a complete freeby why change.

If you do to ,why do you keep saying others wont . Are you that frightened of not getting work you feel the need to slag other cheaper installers off.

bengasman · 20 May 2009

namsag said:
Bengas do you have two standards of work then, one for customers you are making a mint out of and one you are not making as much out of.

2 rates.
One reasonable, not cheap, not very expensive either, always relative to other quotes I hear.
The other one is a zero rate for jobs that I do as a favour for whatever reason.
The quality is always pretty much the same.

It is not a matter of slagging off cheaper work, but of exposing inferior jobs for what they are.
If somebody wants to try their luck and go cheap, they have my blessing. And it is not impossible to get a cheapo job done which works fine for years, though I wouldn't count on it.
What I don't like is cowboys pretending that they just earn less and do an equally good job whilst using inferior materials and cutting corners on the workmanship.

I have yet to find an installer working in the same area who provides good quality for significantly less money. He will have the same fixed costs, the same amount of time lost in traffic jams, the same costs for parking and so on and so forth.
And you simply can not do a quality install for only a few hundred quid, unless the system is clean, all the rads and valves fine, the gaspipe big enough, and you can just take the old boiler off, and stick the new one in.

namsag · 20 May 2009

So you do a really ****e job when not being paid then. Which would back up your comments on others or do you go against what you constantly put and do a good job irrespective .
If so what makes you think your different from others you slag on here

bengasman · 20 May 2009

Would be interesting to know what you base these conclusions on.
I have been accused of many things, but rarely of being inconsistent.

namsag · 20 May 2009

Is it not you that keeps saying that if someone does a cheap job it must be sub standard and cowboy and you could condem it within minutes in several areas if you looked at it.
Or is that someone else

bengasman · 20 May 2009

namsag said:
Is it not you that keeps saying that if someone does a cheap job it must be sub standard and cowboy and you could condem it within minutes in several areas if you looked at it.
Or is that someone else

That sounds like the gospel according to Ben.
And I still have to see the first junior, or old i-series that is installed up to spec.

Haven't seen where I contradict myself either.

namsag · 20 May 2009

From previous post you do struggle to understand the basics of standards so can understand that.

bengasman · 20 May 2009

namsag said:
From previous post you do struggle to understand the basics of standards so can understand that.

Too bad it is too complicated to point out, I am always in for learning things.
Unless you are talking about moral standards, I will be the first to admit I don't have any.

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Am I better off buying the boiler myself?

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