How best should I re-wire this? (split post)

SixDegrees · 3 Oct 2009

Just signed up, as there seem to be some knowledge on the subject. Now, I'm not a tradesman or the like, but fairly comptenet DIYer.

Oven - 3400W, 1.5-2.5mm cable, can be 13A plug'd if need be
Hob - 6000W, 4-6mm cable, 45A

I replaced the Oven about 1 yr ago but hob has sat in box (many reasons why hob not fitted at same time) but now its going to be fitted.

Behind the oven are 2x 13A switches (not sockets), in vertical placement one directly above the other. One wired to the Cooker Switch above the counter (big Red switch with light), the other into god-knows where but cabling is fairly chunky.

The Oven is wired to the lower switch which is connected to the Cooker Switch. The 'sparker' from the GAS hob (now removed - by Corgi Reg Gas Fitter!) was wired direct to the upper switch and not controled via the Cooker Switch - presumably so you could use gas hob without need for Oven to be on.

From reading the above I understand I can treat these 2 appliances as one.

How best should I re-wire this?

I'd get a spark in to do the job if it required a substantial re-wire but I seems like I just need to replace the 2 switches with a dual-purpose job and wire both to the Cooker Switch.

Can someone give me a few specific pointers?

Thanks

ColJack · 3 Oct 2009

change the one that's wired to the cooker switch to a dual back box and sit a 13A socket and a cooker outlet plate..

View media item 10929 View media item 10930

SixDegrees · 3 Oct 2009

ColJack said:
change the one that's wired to the cooker switch to a dual back box and sit a 13A socket and a cooker outlet plate..

View media item 10929 View media item 10930

Thanks, so you can get a specific dual-purpose / combo back-box?

I take it that this has one feed in from the Cooker Switch, and then splits inside the box to a cooker [hob] out, and 13A socket.

I wasn't planning on using a plug/socket as Instructions say only use 13A plu/socket if it can be accessed when oven is in place, so thought I go hard-wired to 13A switch????

Pics are apprecaited.

sparkyspike · 3 Oct 2009

There are two reasons why you should leave a socket accessible, rather than behind the oven.

One is that you need to be able to turn the isolator off in an emergency. This isn't an issue as you will be using the cooker switch for this.

Another is that if the 13A plug fuse goes, you need to be able to replace it. As this occurence will be rarely or never, then you may consider it acceptable to keep the socket hidden behind the oven.

However, for 3400W, I would use an unswitched fused spur instead of a socket as plug tops have a tendency to overheat, especially when the connection between plug and socket isn't perfect.

Steve · 3 Oct 2009

ColJack said:
change the one that's wired to the cooker switch to a dual back box and sit a 13A socket and a cooker outlet plate..

View media item 10929 View media item 10930

How many times have you aired these photos now Col?

ban-all-sheds · 3 Oct 2009

sparkyspike said:
However, for 3400W, I would use an unswitched fused spur instead of a socket as plug tops have a tendency to overheat, especially when the connection between plug and socket isn't perfect.

And even more especially when they are asked to carry 14-15A....

sparkyspike - the OP may think he is a fairly competent DIYer, and maybe he is in non-electrical areas, but what's your excuse?

You're a sparky, so how do you explain Ib <= In <= Iz in the context of a 3400W load and a 13A protective device?

sparkyspike · 3 Oct 2009

ban-all-sheds said:
what's your excuse?

Diversity!

ban-all-sheds · 3 Oct 2009

Don't be ridiculous.

Paul_C · 3 Oct 2009

Hob - 6000W, 4-6mm cable, 45A

Where does the 45A come from? 6kW is only 25 - 26A @ 230/240V.

sparkyspike said:
Diversity!

How does diversity come into play with a single 3.4kW oven as the load?

SixDegrees · 3 Oct 2009

Paul_C said:
Hob - 6000W, 4-6mm cable, 45A

Click to expand...

Where does the 45A come from? 6kW is only 25 - 26A @ 230/240V.

sparkyspike said:

Diversity!

Click to expand...

How does diversity come into play with a single 3.4kW oven as the load?

Plate on back on Hob states 450v 45A.

Here's a link to the Hob user manual

http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/c...4187_C_Top_MID]_C61RAAST_XEU-00031A-01_EN.pdf

Hob is brand new, UK boxed. Came as kit with oven. I kind of though the 450V 45A was odd as the manual states 230v input.

ban-all-sheds · 3 Oct 2009

My largest pan is 310mm in diameter, which is not uncommonly large.

What would happen if I wanted to use it on the front right zone?

SixDegrees · 3 Oct 2009

ban-all-sheds said:
My largest pan is 310mm in diameter, which is not uncommonly large.

What would happen if I wanted to use it on the front right zone?

You can't !!

Not that I care too much about that, even with 2 kids and Mrs we only ever have one or 2 pans on at a time.

More concerned with how best to wire the darn thing than whether or not a pan that I don't have can fit on a hot-plate I probably won't use !!

Paul_C · 3 Oct 2009

Can't seem to get that link to the manual to work at the moment, but.....

Plate on back on Hob states 450v 45A.

Something isn't quite right there. None of the figures you've given so far line up, and 450V is just not a standard utilization voltage.

ericmark · 3 Oct 2009

The plate is always the thing to go by as similar models are likely made for different markets. The instructions show ability to use split phase supply which is common in France so maybe yours is designed for French market?

It must be quite old as it states it will heat up quicker which with avant of induction hobs is no longer correct it will be slower than an induction hob.

As to diversity there is some allowed but it is the biggest element plus percentage of the rest and for an oven we would expect a single element unless called a double oven.

With so many uncertainties and of course the Part P laws it would seem prudent not to DIY.

SixDegrees · 3 Oct 2009

ericmark said:
The plate is always the thing to go by as similar models are likely made for different markets. The instructions show ability to use split phase supply which is common in France so maybe yours is designed for French market?

It must be quite old as it states it will heat up quicker which with avant of induction hobs is no longer correct it will be slower than an induction hob.

As to diversity there is some allowed but it is the biggest element plus percentage of the rest and for an oven we would expect a single element unless called a double oven.

With so many uncertainties and of course the Part P laws it would seem prudent not to DIY.

2007/2008 model. Bought late 2008 from Boots Appliances, made for UK market. Still available from Samsung so can't be that old.

Anyway, I'll do some more thinking / investgation, if I'm comfortable on what is required I'll set about it, if not (and I'm not yet) then I'll call a spark into do it for me.... I know my limits and whether or not I understand something well enough to do the job or get someone in!

diynot

If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.

Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.

Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local

How best should I re-wire this? (split post)

sparkyspike

sparkyspike

Paul_C

Paul_C

Similar threads