Advice for using solvent based paints?

Hi Becka

No need to defend yourself. Joe does seem to have been a little curt but i doubt that was his intention.

please do check with Zinsser before adding Owatrol- Tel: +44 (0)191 410 6611

To date I have only found one oil based paint that it didn't make flow- Beckers thixotropic eggshell.

I am intrigued to find out what it is that prevents the paint from yellowing.

Might even phone them myself.

There are new products coming to the market every day- 95% are crap but some really do make life easier.

Owatrol also make a product to help waterbased paints flow- Floetrol

Just out of interest why did you buy the paint in the first place?
 
Sponsored Links
I searched for information online about the penetrol paint condition / thinner to help with brush tacks and extend the time before drying but the only information I found said that it would thin etc but it caused yellowing.
I chose the Zinsser all coat for three reasons:- 1. I've spent a lot of money on other paints which haven't lived up to expectations or the job, 2. I believed Zinsser's hype and the reviews of their products online are very good and finally, 3. I found it cheap on Ebay and it should be a fantastic product for both my plaster walls and my nasty plastic wood!
I find it quite a steep learning curve decorating which is why I've really found reading previous threads and answers to my own very helpful. As we all know trial and error while you learn what not to do again can be very costly!
Thanks again,
Becka
 
Sorry can't agree with any of that. Pro decorators use ordinary primers etc - not speciality paints made to fool the unwary. All you need do is sand the melamine to remove the shine then paint as normal. What do you intend to do with the shelves that require armour plating? Normal paints are quite capable of doing the job for peanuts.

Oh and one last thing - if you want to thin water based paints - then go to the kitchen tap! That's what's in it - water!
 
Sponsored Links
Links in this post may contain affiliate links for which DIYnot may be compensated.
I searched for information online about the penetrol paint condition / thinner to help with brush tacks and extend the time before drying but the only information I found said that it would thin etc but it caused yellowing.
I chose the Zinsser all coat for three reasons:- 1. I've spent a lot of money on other paints which haven't lived up to expectations or the job, 2. I believed Zinsser's hype and the reviews of their products online are very good and finally, 3. I found it cheap on Ebay and it should be a fantastic product for both my plaster walls and my nasty plastic wood!
I find it quite a steep learning curve decorating which is why I've really found reading previous threads and answers to my own very helpful. As we all know trial and error while you learn what not to do again can be very costly!
Thanks again,
Becka

I believe that penetrol and owatrol are the same product. Just different names in different countries.

As i said I use it on a daily basis but i cannot say if it makes the paint yellow any faster. I do know that oilbased paints yellow faster now that they have reduced the solvents and oils. i can't see why adding a small amount of oil back into the paint would increase yellowing.

In-spite of some of the comments on this thread Zinsser are far from being a gimmicky company. Thanks for bring my attention to the product, it forced me to review thier product range for the first time in a while.

I have been doing this stuff for years but I will never be too old to want to try new products in the hope of making me more productive.

Thanks becka and good luck
 
Sorry can't agree with any of that. Pro decorators use ordinary primers etc - not speciality paints made to fool the unwary. All you need do is sand the melamine to remove the shine then paint as normal. What do you intend to do with the shelves that require armour plating? Normal paints are quite capable of doing the job for peanuts.

Oh and one last thing - if you want to thin water based paints - then go to the kitchen tap! That's what's in it - water!

Joe-90

You seem to have a problem with Zinsser, I have no idea why.

frankly I don't think that attacking new members is acceptable. The OP has researched a product for a given job and then decided to use it in a different role. One that it is evidently suitable for.

You are entitled to your opinion but that entitlement does not make you right.

Frankly you are wrong about adding water to water based paints. All that does is thin it. If you do not want to use proprietary products you can use propylene glycol but then you have to go to a chemist and pay through the nose for it.

With regard to melamine and normal paints i disagree- I have used them and then seen the result of normal wear and tear.

granted there is often more than one right way to do a job, by the same token there are countless ways of doing it incorrectly. it doesn't follow that yours (or mine) is the only way to do it properly.
 
I'm giving here the advice she needs - not what she (or you) seem to want.

Water is very good at thinning water based paints - that's what the manufacturers put in it.

Her real problem is in her technique - but you haven't even mentioned that.

She's applying the paint too thick and not brushing it out. A tiny bit of water to make the paint flow, and with guidance, she might do a half decent job, but oil based undercoat would do far better.
 
Joe,
Clearly you have a great wealth of experience, but why would I use water to thin a solvent based paint? Surely water wouldn't mix properly since I have to use white spirit to clean the paint from the brushes?
To be quite honest as you have suggested, I was very aware that my technique was very probably at fault but as I have mentioned, I don't have countless years of experience. As I have also stated, I'm using a product that I already have for another task to save me having to buy yet another tin of paint. I take on board your product knowledge and preferences but at least allow me the courtesy to make my own, in your opinion, mistakes and attempt to sort them. Maybe you could have made your comments on my first post when I asked about the paint suitable for the task?
You don't like my technique or paint choice, I haven't done things your way but that's life and there's no need to make me like I can't post on this board due to my apparent ignorance.
Thanks,
Becka
 
I thought you said it was water based? If not then a tiny amount of thinner until it stops dragging and flows. It will tell you on the back of the tin what to use as a thinner. If you want to get a good finish then all the pretty words in the world won't help you - what you need is instruction so that you DO get the results that you want. Throwing money at it with expensive thinners won't help if your technique is wrong. That is the advice that people should be giving you.
 
Joe I agree that it is likely that Becka's lack of experience is part of the problem but this is underlined by the fact that she has come here asking for advice.

The products that I have recommended are not thinners and thus they do not thin the paint. They WILL help users of all skill levels to maintain a wet edge and reduce tram lines.

Owatrol is a mixture of linseed oil and turps. I don't recommend that punters try their own mixes because it might take weeks for the paint to dry if they get it wrong. Owatrol is not cheap (initial outlay) but it goes really far.

I have no idea if Becka is applying the paint too thickly or not. The flow rate of paint is a function of a number of things: viscosity and atmospheric conditions being two of them. However retarding the rate at which they evaporate will give one a longer working window. This enables the user to move the paint with less dragging. Applying too thin a coat can reduce the longevity of some paints, please see my earlier point about the follies of thinning.

With regard to Zinsser and American products I tend to find the American market to be more innovative than ours. Just compare higher end American brushes to ours...

BTW Becka

You can probably also get advice about Owatrol and this Zinsser paint from Rishi, the owner of Ray Munn in Fulham- he is normally quite knowledgeable about Zinsser paints.

http://raymunn.co.uk/contact.htm
 
Sorry mate but it is a thinner paint that you need. Apply quickly, lay off and walk away - perfect finish every time. Do you never thin your paints?
 
Sorry mate but it is a thinner paint that you need. Apply quickly, lay off and walk away - perfect finish every time. Do you never thin your paints?

err... yes I do use thinners, I mentioned earlier that since "2010 voc" i now use white spirit, owatrol and terebene.

With dulux Trade eggshell I use the thinners to thin and the owatrol to ****** drying time, then the terebene to reduce the time needed to dry before resanding.

I paint MDF units day in/day out to a very high finish, one of the highest in West London (units have not been primed with acid cat first).

Getting a quality finish is not just a matter of painting quickly. I want my tramlines to be parallel and i don't want paint build up on door edges. By applying sufficiently thick and even coats I am able to paint from scratch with one acrylic primer and two coats of oildbased eggshell.

If I could get away with using white spirits exclusively then I would but I am not willing to compromise a finish that has taken me many hours to "perfect".

Most paint manufacturers only recommend water or white spirits because they are not in the habit of promoting 3rd party products. Spray equipment makers however will recommend products such as owatrol and Floetrol because they don't make paints and want to enable punters to get a good a finish as possible from their products.
 
I thin my paints a tad and get NO tramlines - level or otherwise. It's all in the technique.
 
I thin my paints a tad and get NO tramlines - level or otherwise. It's all in the technique.

Joe you are indeed the Übermensch that Nietzsche referred to.

Perhaps your time might be better devoted to teaching others your divine technique. Imagine the environmental savings in paint wastage that could be achieved if we as your acolytes never needed to spray paints ever again in the pursuit of perfectly flat finishes.

With your guidance the world really could be flat.

Your obedient servant...
 

DIYnot Local

Staff member

If you need to find a tradesperson to get your job done, please try our local search below, or if you are doing it yourself you can find suppliers local to you.

Select the supplier or trade you require, enter your location to begin your search.


Are you a trade or supplier? You can create your listing free at DIYnot Local

 
Sponsored Links
Back
Top