LPG or Oil

Richardthe3rd · 4 Jan 2014

Kero was always cheaper than LPG & will always be I guess. LPG is a product of a petrol refinery & has never been sold on its economic running cost, only convenience in rural areas, for cooking, fires etc.

If your parents will use the multi-fuel stove a lot, you've a well insulated house & cheap oil, there's no real debate really. I'd not recommend an oil combi though, they're the work of the Devil - poor flow rate & expensive to run.
HTH

wcavanagh · 4 Jan 2014

Thanks, I the Grant one I am looking at has 17 L / min 50 degree and 3 min recovery time. Seems better than I used to get from my old Gas Combi when I was living in England.

What would you suggest other than combi then? I am still at first fix stage, so open to all ideas, maybe something I have not thought of.

Woody12 · 4 Jan 2014

We've got one of these:

http://www.grantuk.com/products/oil-fired-condensing-boilers/

(I think we have the pro 15-21)

Keeps our large 18th C. 3 bed cottage very warm and hardly uses any oil compared to our old boiler.

We even bought it second hand - a year old and only cost £150!

Very pleased with it.

NB - we had a gas combi in our previous property, all I'll say is, NEVER again!

Collectors · 17 Jan 2014

I know its an old thread, but i just fitted a boiler for my new central heating system & the boiler cost me £702.00 to buy in comparison to nearly £1500.00 for the oil equivalent. Wile we have a JCB on site we ordered a 2400lt underground tank that cost £407-00 from Avanti gas & will hold 2000lt allowing for expansion. including the pipe to the house.
A 1900lt oil tank is around £1500-00 plus the piping & fitting(lets say another £300.00 min).
So! so far the gas cost £1109.00 & the oil £3300.00 a difference of £2191.00 of free gas.
For me, that's around 3-4 years worth.
I also get the advantage of gas cooking & just a small manhole cover to look at.

Oh! The boiler was a Glow Worm 30sxi & was ready for LPG out the box.

dcawkwell · 17 Jan 2014

Collectors said:
I know its an old thread, but i just fitted a boiler for my new central heating system & the boiler cost me £702.00 to buy in comparison to nearly £1500.00 for the oil equivalent. Wile we have a JCB on site we ordered a 2400lt underground tank that cost £407-00 from Avanti gas & will hold 2000lt allowing for expansion. including the pipe to the house.
A 1900lt oil tank is around £1500-00 plus the piping & fitting(lets say another £300.00 min).
So! so far the gas cost £1109.00 & the oil £3300.00 a difference of £2191.00 of free gas.
For me, that's around 3-4 years worth.
I also get the advantage of gas cooking & just a small manhole cover to look at.

Oh! The boiler was a Glow Worm 30sxi & was ready for LPG out the box.

Out of interest how much do you pay for tank rental?

JulianP · 17 Jan 2014

Go for oil. I've had both.

LPG suppliers tie you into two year contracts and there's no get out.

Also remember that LPG and oil are priced by the Litre. Energy content of the fuel is closely related to weight. So LPG at about 0.6SG and oil at 0.8 Factor that into a cost comparison and there's no contest.

What I love about oil was phoning up the suppliers in the summer when they're scratching for work and getting good prices for a fill up for winter.

Also if you go for a nice simple standard pressure jet type oil boiler then you can do all the servicing yourself without getting your ear chewed by CORGI!

kbdiy · 17 Jan 2014

wcavanagh said:
and having the roof spray foam insulated.

I'd steer clear of that idea if I were you. Does little for insulation if you insulate the loft properly (as you intend to do) and has been known to cause more problems than it cures - reducing airflow around the loft for instance. It was a quick fix alternative to re-roofing older properties but never really delivered what it promised.

Collectors · 17 Jan 2014

dcawkwell said:
Collectors said:

I know its an old thread, but i just fitted a boiler for my new central heating system & the boiler cost me £702.00 to buy in comparison to nearly £1500.00 for the oil equivalent. Wile we have a JCB on site we ordered a 2400lt underground tank that cost £407-00 from Avanti gas & will hold 2000lt allowing for expansion. including the pipe to the house.
A 1900lt oil tank is around £1500-00 plus the piping & fitting(lets say another £300.00 min).
So! so far the gas cost £1109.00 & the oil £3300.00 a difference of £2191.00 of free gas.
For me, that's around 3-4 years worth.
I also get the advantage of gas cooking & just a small manhole cover to look at.

Oh! The boiler was a Glow Worm 30sxi & was ready for LPG out the box.

Click to expand...

£24 a quarter, but that is an insurance as well.

Out of interest how much do you pay for tank rental?

Norcon · 17 Jan 2014

Collectors price on the oil tank is inaccurate by a hefty margin.
A Harlequin 2000/l bunded tank is £1030. Fittings and pipe less than £100 probably.

A Grant vortex utility 21kw boiler about £1000. I expect he has purchased himself a troublesome combi model with dubious hw delivery capability.

He also has not added in the considerable cost of having his gas tank buried! JCB's don't run on thin air!
And of course with oil you have a safer boiler and a lot easier to work on.

My 14 year old oil boiler has never been serviced and it runs on and on and on....

Collectors · 18 Jan 2014

Norcon said:
Collectors price on the oil tank is inaccurate by a hefty margin.
A Harlequin 2000/l bunded tank is £1030. Fittings and pipe less than £100 probably.

A Grant vortex utility 21kw boiler about £1000. I expect he has purchased himself a troublesome combi model with dubious hw delivery capability.

He also has not added in the considerable cost of having his gas tank buried! JCB's don't run on thin air!
And of course with oil you have a safer boiler and a lot easier to work on.

My 14 year old oil boiler has never been serviced and it runs on and on and on....

My fault on the tank, we would of had to have a pump fitted for the oil as we couldn't work it on gravity & that added a few hundred with the pump & added electrics.
The boiler was a 30kw sealed system basic boiler (none combi) as a 21kw would not have been enough.
We where a little lucky on the JCB as that was a quick £40 to the driver & the hole was dug in less than an 1/2 hour. But we could of got a mini digger for a week for £150 & also put it to many other uses.
In all, a lot cheaper than laying a concrete slab for a tank we didn't want to see.

JulianP · 19 Jan 2014

Collectors said:
[
In all, a lot cheaper than laying a concrete slab for a tank we didn't want to see.

To be honest an oil tank is very easy to hide with a few shrubs/trellis/WHY.

A gas tank is a royal PITA to hide as the company have a hissy fit if combustible materials get placed near the tank, and that includes plants.

I think your idea of so many years worth of savings is highly optimistic because:
1/ the inflated price of the oil tank you state
2/ the tiny gas usage you suggest - you must be very careful!
3/ the cost differential between oil and gas
4/ the gas tank rental costs
5/ DIY service for oil if you're so minded

Then once the time is up on the (alleged) savings period it's all downhill

Having lived in properties with both then I'd say oil is best. Most of the people I know in my locality agree with me. If you want a gas cooker then a simple regulator and propane bottle will do the job. Gas consumption for a cooker is negligible compared to heating and a bottle will last you ages. plus the fact that the cooker is a source of room heating if you have a power cut....

Julian

crashndie · 19 Jan 2014

Get a biomass boiler and get paid to heat you home via rhi.. gas is around 4.4p oil is about 5.8p and lpg is about 6.8p per kwh to run biomass is 4.4p per kwh for wood pellets but the government pay you 12.2p for 7 years there is a £2000 grant towards the install of it. After the 7 years your paying gas prices prob less than gas because it would have gone up 10 fold by then ... Its a No Brainer

JulianP · 19 Jan 2014

crashndie said:
Get a biomass boiler and get paid to heat you home via rhi.. gas is around 4.4p oil is about 5.8p and lpg is about 6.8p per kwh to run biomass is 4.4p per kwh for wood pellets but the government pay you 12.2p for 7 years there is a £2000 grant towards the install of it. After the 7 years your paying gas prices prob less than gas because it would have gone up 10 fold by then ... Its a No Brainer

I looked at a property with a biomass system installed a few weeks ago.

TBO it frightened me stupid. The boiler alone was about 17K and had a heat store about the size of a kiddies swimming pool. A huge wooden hopper the size of a room for the pellets, an auger and a boiler control that looked capable of adaption to land a space vehicle on Mars!

Massive complication, many breakdowns and manufacturer's parts and fitter call out charges. I doubt a regular boiler man would have a clue how diagnose and fix.

Couple that with the likelihood that the gubbinsment may withdraw or reduce all these green bsollocks incentives on a whim and I'm far from convinced.

When I looked over the installation the first thing I said to myself was ''how can I parallel a cheap little floor standing gas boiler into this lot so we have a back-up for when it fails......

crashndie · 19 Jan 2014

17 k is tad ott its pritty new tech over here to us, but its proven abroad been out for years over there. the thermo store size is dependent on the size of the house and kw of the boiler don't be put off by the tech have a look at this one http://www.windhager.co.uk/products/wood-pellet-boilers/variowin/ look for a good company who wants to do a good job an not make a 300% profit line...

the green deal rhi is locked in for 7 years at the price at the time applied for rises with inflation too.

as for servicing any heatas engineer with h005 will maintain it and to be honest there is only a few things on them to go wrong..

On your other point boiler back up is just as easy to install, just link it in to the main heating flow and return with a zone valve

look a bit more in to it and get a few quotes ...

JulianP · 19 Jan 2014

crashndie said:
17 k is tad ott its pritty new tech over here to us, but its proven abroad been out for years over there. the thermo store size is dependent on the size of the house and kw of the boiler don't be put off by the tech have a look at this one http://www.windhager.co.uk/products/wood-pellet-boilers/variowin/ look for a good company who wants to do a good job an not make a 300% profit line...

the green deal rhi is locked in for 7 years at the price at the time applied for rises with inflation too.

as for servicing any heatas engineer with h005 will maintain it and to be honest there is only a few things on them to go wrong..

On your other point boiler back up is just as easy to install, just link it in to the main heating flow and return with a zone valve

look a bit more in to it and get a few quotes ...

Yes, I thought I was maybe over-reacting a bit. This boiler was some sort of Swedish jobby I think and was a fair monster. What amazed me was the combustion chamber and the electric ignition system for the fuel pellets The guy showed me the minute quantity of ash that landed into a small hopper that he said only needed emptying every 10 days or so. Sadly it was not burning pellets when I looked at because all the temps were right up and the owner couldn't remember how to fiddle with the controls to make it fire up

diynot

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