Site Security - is this quote crazy?

wickedwjc · 27 Apr 2015

Hi All,

I'm in the process of getting quotes for some major works to my house (demolishing garage, extending at front and rear of property). To provide a bit of context i'm on a corner plot which is totally exposed so no wall or fence between my plot and the pavement. I understand that the site will need securing both from the point of view that I don't want materials going missing and also from the HSE perspective.

I've been given a quote that shows £3500+VAT for a 2.4 meter high timber hoarding (50 meters long). Both the height and cost of this seem excessive to me. Having seen similar works going on elsewhere I've noticed many of them just have orange plastic mesh barriers 1m high with pins - the overall cost being approx 2% of what I've been quoted!

Can anyone give me their opinion/views on this? £4200 seems like a hell of a lot for something temporary.

Cheers

Nige F · 27 Apr 2015

Have a look at Heras Fencing hire

. Interesting about the hoarding price . Where I live there is a vacant site that was boarded about the same size as yours. The developers didn't like that so replaced it with their own different colour and full size posters on it etc . But what's £10k when you're a nationwide developer of retirement condos ? . I'm sure they will screw the subbies prices right down .

Newboy · 27 Apr 2015

With respect - a road pins and 1m orange site mesh fence isn't going to achieve either of your objectives!

The pricing for timber hording seems about right

Heras fencing will enable the site to be secured against casual visitors/thieving whilst maintaining visibility.

noseall · 27 Apr 2015

We've done both and the ply hoarding is a lot more expensive. We didn't have a single Banksy on the ply hoarding either!

We could probably do the 50m ply fella for aboot £2800 inc.

The Heras fencing will be a fraction of the price.

jay679 · 28 Apr 2015

I would go with heras fencing for general site security and a shipping container for securing tools and materials. Buy from ebay and then sell again afterwards.

^woody^ · 22 Aug 2016

I've never seen hoarding, significant fencing or "site security" on a domestic job. Unless no one is living there and it's a massive site or in a dodgy area.

What a waste of money. Cover materials with a tarp.

Deleted member 174758 · 22 Aug 2016

Firstly the 2.4 metre height is simply a product of the standard size if sheet materials - c.2.4 x 1.2 metres. Secondly in law you have a duty of care to prevent unauthorised people accessing the site both during the working day and out of hours - that includes not only the local kids but also thieves and vandals. That's why if the build is a big one you need to carry insurance anf segregate the site (and cones/plastic crowd barriers aren't enough). I think that the amount of thieving which goes on on sites these days I'd opt for either Heras fencing or closed panel steel fencing and a lockable container until the building itself can be secured and all holes in the ground for services, etc have been filled

^woody^ · 22 Aug 2016

JobAndKnock said:
in law you have a duty of care to prevent unauthorised people accessing the site both during the working day and out of hours

There is no such duty.

Deleted member 174758 · 22 Aug 2016

If someone enters a site (as defined in law - it is a place of work) then the responsible person most certainly does have just such a duty. Furthermore as a householder if someone comes onto your property and injures themselves then you have a probable liability in law.

^woody^ · 22 Aug 2016

JobAndKnock said:
If someone enters a site (as defined in law - it is a place of work) then the responsible person most certainly does have just such a duty. Furthermore as a householder if someone comes onto your property and injures themselves then you have a probable liability in law.

There is no duty to secure a site.

You find me the law that says there is, I will have a chuckle and then tell you what you think you mean.

Deleted member 174758 · 22 Aug 2016

If the site is operating for more than 30 days (with 20 or more persons on site at any one time) or where it exceeds 500 man days duration it is notifiable to the HSE on form F10 -that's a big refurb but a lot of £50 to £60k domestic jobs would be getting close. At that point it becomes a place of work and you can indeed leave the gates open but Common Law places a duty on you to ensure that all reasonable steps are taken to ensure that anyone coming onto the site at any time, are in so far as is practicable, protected from harm. If a burglar enters the site and falls off a roof because the site was left open and unprotected with ladders in place just who do you think is responsible in law? The burglar, the main contractor or the householder?

^woody^ · 22 Aug 2016

JobAndKnock said:
If the site is operating for more than 30 days (with 20 or more persons on site at any one time) or where it exceeds 500 man days duration it is notifiable to the HSE on form F10 -that's a big refurb but a lot of £50 to £60k domestic jobs would be getting close. At that point it becomes a place of work and you can indeed leave the gates open but Common Law places a duty on you to ensure that all reasonable steps are taken to ensure that anyone coming onto the site at any time, are in so far as is practicable, protected from harm. If a burglar enters the site and falls off a roof because the site was left open and unprotected with ladders in place just who do you think is responsible in law? The burglar, the main contractor or the householder?

Hmmm. Looks like you're combining the CDM Regs, some random HASaW legislation and common law to get some sort of Frankencrap Law.

To be clear, there is no duty to fence the site under any Statute or Common Law.

CDM Regulations = no duty to fence the site. Rather have safe systems of work at work.
HASaW = no duty to fence the site. Rather to protect the health, safety and welfare at work of employees and others

I don't know how a perimeter security fence protects workers at work.

Occupiers Liabilty Act 57 - to prevent injury to lawful visitors, and the 84 Act with the same duty to unlawful visitors. This can be dealt with by a sign, not a fence. There is a greater duty towards children, but if the child scales a fence the duty is still there if the site is dangerous, likewise for the trespasser.

So the duty is not to have a fence, but the have a safe site.

Like I said, throw a tarp around the materials

freddiemercurystwin · 22 Aug 2016

You know thread was dragged back into life by a spamhead you pair of bickering old tarts.

^woody^ · 23 Aug 2016

Ha ha.

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Site Security - is this quote crazy?

Newboy

Deleted member 174758

Deleted member 174758

Deleted member 174758

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