Regulations covering gas installations

I am rebuilding MY kitchen and want to install a gas hob, LPG because no gas on in my village.

Reading another old thread it states that it requires a Gas Safe/LPG ticket by law and cites this regulation:

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si1998/19982451.htm

However this regulation does not say that. Clause 1 requires that it has to be a competent person, absolutely useless because it does not define what one is. Further clauses then details what are the duties of an employee/employer are which are not applicable.

What regulation absolutely cites that ONLY a Gas Safe engineer can do this work end to end. I need to lay in pipework as a 1st fix prior to closing off the void it runs through (no jointing involved) and want to keep the building inspector on board.

I am quite happy to stay within legal requirements but what one? The responses are not backed up by the legal regulation. I know all about the safety angles so that does not need to be repeated.

GSIUR probably
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/priced/l56.pdf

regulation 3

From the little that he has written I would expect that he is not competent to carry out gas work safely!

The simple advice is to employ a gas safe qualified person rather than looking for excuses not to!

Tony

All he needs to do is read the regs he linked to -

As Prentice mentions - Section B - Reg 3 - subsection 3, 7 and Reg 4

Within the regs Guidance notes - Specifically note 43 - To work on gas an employee/self employed/diy gas person to be considered competent, the person must be a member of an approved class of persons as currently defined by the HSE - Currently that class is confirmed by being members of the Gas Safe Register.
Further explanations of acceptable proof of competence can be found in guidance notes - 46 & 47. Guidance note 48 is also quite specific for LPG.

If it is your kitchen, and you make it clear that it is, you can do whatever you like.

If there were consequences, then you would have to prove you had not been negligent. Which is when the courts reference the documents regarding competence etc. So you won't have an argument.

So it is up to you. But be aware LPG is considerably more dangerous than NG.

This has been debated ad infinitum on this forum.

The simple solution is to pay a qualified person to do it

If u want to keep the building inspecter on board then use the correct person who can sign it off. Simple as that.

simond said:

If it is your kitchen, and you make it clear that it is, you can do whatever you like.

If there were consequences, then you would have to prove you had not been negligent. Which is when the courts reference the documents regarding competence etc. So you won't have an argument.

So it is up to you. But be aware LPG is considerably more dangerous than NG.

This has been debated ad infinitum on this forum.

Click to expand...

might be a good idea to see what your house insurance says as well, in case it all goes pete tong

Agile said:

From the little that he has written I would expect that he is not competent to carry out gas work safely!

Tony

Click to expand...

A wrong assumption. The question is limited to the basic fact that I require clarification on.

Under accepted definitions covering other regulations where the term is used I AM a competent person. I hold pertinent qualifications far in excess of the specific requirement of safe working with combustible gases and get a little annoyed being told "how to suck eggs" when somebody assumes that I could not possibly know what they do just because I don't have the relevant piece of paper. When I sign something off as safe and serviceable in my profession if I was wrong it could virtually guarantee the death of up to 300 people a time so I cannot afford to be wrong in my line of work - ever.

However I am quite willing if required to employ a suitably qualified person when necessary, I was just seeking clarification as to when that might be.

It is a regrettable fact that many trades have a small number of supposedly qualified persons which bring the particular profession into disrepute. For example today I have been trying to unpick the wiring scheme the NICEIC certificated electrician adopted when installing my central heating system. Although to be fair it does work he had decided to ignore the standard S plan layout and work to his own entirely arbitrary scheme which makes it more difficult to fault find or modify.

In my previous property the seller declared that the central heating system had been serviced regularly. On closer inspection I saw the telltale signs of poor combustion in the BAXI Glo-Worm back boiler (stains around the fire front, yellow flames which take too long to settle to a clean burn). In the end I removed an entire bucket full of deposits from around the heat exchanger, cleaned the existing air vent and fitted a second one to bring the room up to the required level of ventilation for the appliance, the flue was swept as well.

So 300 dead in one go makes you an aircraft engineer, doesn't mean yor competent to work on gas, would you see any issue if I said as a gas engineer I'm competent to come and sign off the auto pilot system on a holiday plane?

The fact is, it's your own home, your the king of your castle, you do what you choose.

I can't be arsed



(@ the OP, not Lee )

Madrab said:

All he needs to do is read the regs he linked to -

As Prentice mentions - Section B - Reg 3 - subsection 3, 7 and Reg 4

Within the regs Guidance notes - Specifically note 43 - To work on gas an employee/self employed/diy gas person to be considered competent, the person must be a member of an approved class of persons as currently defined by the HSE - Currently that class is confirmed by being members of the Gas Safe Register.
Further explanations of acceptable proof of competence can be found in guidance notes - 46 & 47. Guidance note 48 is also quite specific for LPG.

Click to expand...

Thanks, that takes me a little way to what I was looking for with a couple of caveats. If you look at the remit for HSE it almost totally ignores a non working environment. For example look at the regulations covering the transportation of LPG cylinders. Quite clear and concise in its terms except that it does not cover private individuals, only in a workplace environment. I as that individual have no limitations within law predefined.

To quote the beginning of the document "This guidance is issued by the Health and Safety Executive. Following the guidance is not compulsory, unless specifically stated, and you are free to take other action."

I am just trying to find that "specifically stated".

PrenticeBoyofDerry said:

GSIUR probably
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/priced/l56.pdf

regulation 3

Click to expand...

As per the initial guidance on page 2 "You may use alternative
methods to those set out in the Code in order to comply with the law."

Ref the regulations themselves Section 3

"3.—(1) No person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so. "

So who is competent? It does not specifically state being on the Gas Safe Register.

"(2) The employer of any person carrying out such work for that employer...."

Irrelevant because there is no employee/employer involved. Similarly :

"(3) Without prejudice to the generality of paragraphs (1) and (2) above and subject to paragraph (4) below, no employer shall allow any of his employees....."

Then just get on and DIY your LPG hob. No one will ever find out. Forget trying to convince anyone to the contrary. By any definition you are not considered competent. Gas installation safety & use affects everyone not just those who do it for a living.

alsdad said:

So who is competent? It does not specifically state being on the Gas Safe Register."

Click to expand...

Of course it won't. the words are generic because the class of persons du jour can change. At the moment it's the Gas Safe Register.

alsdad said:

in the BAXI Glo-Worm back boiler

Click to expand...

Eh?
Is dr.drivel back again?