Can a Shaver Light cum socket be connected to the Earth instead of the Neutral ?

Hello forumites,

I had a Vysal Shaver Light cum Dual Voltage Charging Socket which was working perfectly until the builders opened it up for Tiling. Now, after they re-connected, it doesn't work. I bought 2 new Shavers and none would work either. On checking, I found that they do work when connected to a different point. So, the cables coming out of the wall are damaged.
There are Live, Neutral and Earth cables coming out of the wall. However, the Vysal being double isolated, only Live and Neutral were used. Since the Tester glows on the Live, I doubted that the return path was damaged / broken. So, after testing with a multimeter, I find no Voltage across the Live and Neutral, whereas around 240 V across Live and Earth. So, wondering what are my options now and if the Earth can be used instead of the Neutral ? I am not too bothered about charging, as I can always use another socket with adapter. It's the Light that is more important to me. Any suggestions please.

Thanks and Regards

You may absolutely NOT use the earth as a neutral. If you have an RCD you can forget about that plan anyway.

Chances are a cable has become disconnected (it could be damaged), did they/you also take the bathroom light down to decorate? It could well be supplied from there.

Firstly, where does the cable come from?

You really should check that the other end is still connected.

You definitely cannot use earth as a return.

There is a MCD for the whole Bathroom (light and shaver). Yes, they did change the bathroom ceiling light and the pullchord. Maybe, I should check those first. The cables that come out of the wall are quite thick and sturdy Copper Cables and insulated too, so I was surprised that it could be broken.

It could be broken, if a piece of twin and earth flexes backwards and forwards on itself too many times, or is exposed to too much force, it will break. Particularly if it's a bit old and more brittle than when new. It could well be broken in the backbox where the sheath has been removed, you'll be able to tell by gently moving the neutral backwards and forwards/up and down and there will be zero resistance and it will bend at a clear point, rather than moving the whole conductor (power off of course)

Check the light fittings first, then if not, get them back out again.

Almost certainly within the light fitting then - a loose or broken neutral wire.

Look there first.

You could of course get the workers back who presumably caused this, but if you're quite handy and don't want all the aggro, you may be able to do this yourself.

MAKE SURE THE POWER IS FULLY OFF BEFORE YOU START WORK.

Thanks a lot. I'll switch off the MCB and check the light connections and report back.

I've checked. The Light Socket has just 2 connections - Live and Neutral - so I think it can't be wrong.
The Pull Chord is a bit more complicated. I think the incoming has 3 cables + Earth - one Red (Live), 2nd Red with a Yellow Sleeve and the 3rd Blue (Neutral). The outgoing has 2 cables + Earth - one Red (Switched Live) and 1 Black (Neutral).
Now, they have connected the incoming Live to the common terminal of the pull chord and combined the outgoing Red (Switched Live) and the 2nd Red with a Yellow Sleeve from the incoming to the L1 terminal of the pull chord. The switch and the light works. I have also disconnected the 2nd Red with a Yellow Sleeve from the incoming and left it unconnected and it still works fine.
The Neutrals (Blue and Black) are connected via a terminal block. So, the Circuit is complete and looks OK.
Should it affect the Shaver Light Point ? Also, I'm not sure where should the 2nd Red with a Yellow Sleeve from the incoming be connected to ? There seems to be no Voltage Difference across it - neither against the Live, nor against the Neutral ? Is that just a dummy wire ?
I also checked at the Loft and there appears to be a Sheathed Cable coming from the Loft to the Hole in the Wall (for the Shaver Light). On pushing / pulling it, the cables from the hole in the wall move, so that seems to be the cable. It seems to be fine - in the Loft, the sheath is still intact, so chances of damage / break are minimum.
Not sure where the break is ? I have tried moving the Neutral backward / forward, but it is stiff and not loose.
One alternative is to take a new Sheathed Cable from a Socket in the Loft through the hole (if that can at all be done) for the Shaver Light ?

1) It's difficult to follow your description - a diagram and/or photos would be a great help.

2) FYI - chord, pull cord switch

rojroj said:

I also checked at the Loft and there appears to be a Sheathed Cable coming from the Loft to the Hole in the Wall (for the Shaver Light). On pushing / pulling it, the cables from the hole in the wall move, so that seems to be the cable. I

One alternative is to take a new Sheathed Cable from a Socket in the Loft through the hole (if that can at all be done) for the Shaver Light ?

Click to expand...

If you have located the cable, surely the other end can also be located?
It's then a case of removing the old cable and installing a new one. No need to waste time trying to find where it's broken or how the rest of the circuit is wired.

Can you be sure the feed for the shaver light goes to the pullcord?

If it definitely does, could the neutral for it not be connected to the terminal, ie the insulation caught under the screw?

If it definitely does not, is there a JB in the loft?

I will guess the person wiring the switch thought the switch worked an extractor fan not a shaver socket and has simply connected wrong wires. Cure is to call them back to fix it not DIY.

I'll upload photos soon. Just to clarify, the pull chord switch operates just the main bathroom light and also the extractor fan (which has a timer), so the fan comes On when the light is On and goes Off after the light is switched Off. There is a separate switch to turn the fan Off completely.
There is no separate switch for the shaver light, just an inbuilt one that comes with the Shaver Light.
The wire that goes down vertically from the Loft has a grey sheath, while the wire that comes out of the hole in the wall has a white sheath, so I am now confused if that is the right cable at the loft.
If the Neutral on the pull chord was not connected (caught up in the sleeve), how would the pull chord work - that works fine for the main lamp.

Here are the photos.

First I said:

FYI - chord, pull cord switch

Click to expand...

Then you said:

I'll upload photos soon. Just to clarify, the pull chord switch operates just the main bathroom light and also the extractor fan (which has a timer), so the fan comes On when the light is On and goes Off after the light is switched Off. There is a separate switch to turn the fan Off completely.
There is no separate switch for the shaver light, just an inbuilt one that comes with the Shaver Light.
The wire that goes down vertically from the Loft has a grey sheath, while the wire that comes out of the hole in the wall has a white sheath, so I am now confused if that is the right cable at the loft.
If the Neutral on the pull chord was not connected (caught up in the sleeve), how would the pull chord work - that works fine for the main lamp.

Click to expand...

Why?

Anyway...

rojroj said:

There are Live, Neutral and Earth cables coming out of the wall.

Click to expand...

Take your word for it - can't see an earth conductor.


Have you looked at what's going on in the isolation switch on the wall?