Putting bathroom heater on shower circuit?

sparkwright · 20 Jan 2017

Very often an unswitched fused spur in the bathroom out of harms way will be safer than a switched fused spur or a socket.

Usually a wall heater doesn't really require a switch inside or outside the bathroom - as it uually has a pull cord already on it.

Obviously the bathroom safe zones will always apply.

sparkwright · 20 Jan 2017

Op, it would be useful to know how the loft socket is protected at the consumer unit.

It would be good to know the size of fuse or circuit breaker in AMPS.

Also if there is RCD protection already.

It would be useful to check that the socket isn't wired into the lighting circuit, as this won't be man enough for your heater.

deadshort · 20 Jan 2017

And if the heater is class 2

DS

deadshort · 20 Jan 2017

Friday night is Gooooooooogle night

DS

propertydev83 · 20 Jan 2017

JohnW2 said:
As I've already said, I think that running 'fixed wiring' from a plug is 'orrible ('nasty')!! - but, if you really wanted to do that, you wouldn't need the second FCU (there would be a fuse in the plug).

It's not the "right" way, and I know it would turn up some noses, though it is still safe. I think he would prefer it as it is the easiest option.

The switched FCU was still going to be added outside the bathroom as it would allow isolating the heater without entering the loft, though maybe it could be omitted.

sparkwright said:
Yes, it was solely to put the RCD in a more accesible and visible location.

This was my suggestion to him, to keep the RCD nore accessible.

Existing 2.5mm T&E spur into loft from sockets circuit > 13A FCU in loft > 2.5mm T&E > existing socket outlet in loft > 2.5mm T&E down from loft > 13A switched RCD FCU outside bathroom > 2.5mm T&E flex to bathroom heater

It doesn't appear there are RCD FCUs with "real" switches, though.

JohnW2 · 20 Jan 2017

sparkwright said:
Very often an unswitched fused spur in the bathroom out of harms way will be safer than a switched fused spur or a socket.

If, per your suggestion, it were an RCD FCU, it would presumably have to be 'out of zones' as well as 'out of harm's way'?

sparkwright said:
Usually a wall heater doesn't really require a switch inside or outside the bathroom - as it uually has a pull cord already on it.

Agreed. The one selected by the OP certainly has a pull cord. However, I suspect that some people would nevertheless want/advise some sort of external switch/isolator.

Kind ReEgards, John

JohnW2 · 20 Jan 2017

propertydev83 said:
The switched FCU was still going to be added outside the bathroom as it would allow isolating the heater without entering the loft, though maybe it could be omitted.

OK, but if there were an upstream FCU, you wouldn't need a second one there (just a DP switch would do for isolation) - except that you are probably thinking of an RCD outside the bathroom, and an RCD FCU is the only way you can find of getting that?

propertydev83 said:
It doesn't appear there are RCD FCUs with "real" switches, though.

I don't think I've ever seen one. In fact, as above, what you would ideally have (if there were no RCD FCU in the loft) is just an RCD (not with a built-in FCU), but I don't think I've seen an 'accessory-style' one of those. You could put a regular RCD into a 'small' enclosure, but that would be quite bulky, surface mounted and not very beautiful!

Kind Regards, John

ban-all-sheds · 20 Jan 2017

deadshort said:
If not, then spurring off a socket circuit as suggested may be possible if that is compliant? There is a socketIf not, then spurring off a socket circuit as ? in the loft but unfortunately it is already on a spur...)[/QUOTE Just change it to a twin RCD socket and plug the heater into that. easy !

DS[/QUOTE]

Friday night starts early at your place, by the looks of it

ban-all-sheds · 20 Jan 2017

sparkwright said:
It would mean the loft socket would remain unprotected RCD-wise.

So would the bathroom with a N-E fault upstream of that RCD.

propertydev83 · 20 Jan 2017

JohnW2 said:
OK, but if there were an upstream FCU, you wouldn't need a second one there (just a DP switch would do for isolation) - except that you are probably thinking of an RCD outside the bathroom, and an RCD FCU is the only way you can find of getting that?
I don't think I've ever seen one. In fact, as above, what you would ideally have (if there were no RCD FCU in the loft) is just an RCD (not with a built-in FCU), but I don't think I've seen an 'accessory-style' one of those. You could put a regular RCD into a 'small' enclosure, but that would be quite bulky, surface mounted and not very beautiful!

Kind Regards, John

Yeah, I don't think he would like that on the landing!

I'm going to speak to him again in the morning. He'll probably be happy to omit a switch outside the bathroom altogether, and just put a 13A RCD FCU upstream of the socket, then just have the heater plugged into the standard loft socket, and be done with it.

ban-all-sheds · 20 Jan 2017

sparkwright said:
It's rare to see things added to shower circuits, and when you do it has DIY written all over it.

Only because electricians can't think outside of the box well enough to do it.

Anyway - next refurb I'm going to do away with it, and have the fan circuit control the shower via a contactor, rather than the other way round, and lose the great clunky shower switch

ban-all-sheds · 20 Jan 2017

deadshort said:
Friday night is Gooooooooogle night

Bing is better for images.

JohnW2 · 21 Jan 2017

propertydev83 said:
I'm going to speak to him again in the morning. He'll probably be happy to omit a switch outside the bathroom altogether, and just put a 13A RCD FCU upstream of the socket, then just have the heater plugged into the standard loft socket, and be done with it.

I'm already given my views on that

However, I'm a little unclear as to how this cable is going to get from the heater to this plug/socket in the loft - surely not draped through the bathroom and landing and then through the loft hatch?!!

Kind Regards, John

propertydev83 · 21 Jan 2017

JohnW2 said:
I'm already given my views on that However, I'm a little unclear as to how this cable is going to get from the heater to this plug/socket in the loft - surely not draped through the bathroom and landing and then through the loft hatch?!!

Kind Regards, John

Sure. Can always hang wet clothes from the cable to dry out.

No, the bathroom walls are studs so he will drill a hole behind the heater and feed it through and up to the loft.

deadshort · 21 Jan 2017

Good morning,
Sorry, but i have to ask why you don't just change the single socket in the loft to a twin RCD socket ? It's perfectly acceptable and more cost effective. Fit a good quality plug and use 1.5mm flex to the heater (this is fitted as standard) as i have already said the heater is possibly class 2 (double insulated) and does not require an earth.
You'll have it fitted in 1hour

Kind regards,

DS

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Putting bathroom heater on shower circuit?

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