Boiler help needed, I think I'm being taken for a ride :(

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

I'm hoping someone can help with my issue please.

Our 10 year old, regularly serviced, Glow Worm condensing combi boiler has recently started showing error F4 or F1 intermittently. Some days it works all day then another day I get an error code and have to turn the boiler off and back on again several times to get hot water / heating.

I had an engineer out who said the problem is that my heating system needs power flushing and there is nothing he can do until that has been done. I personally think this is a 'fob off' / easy money.

I've looked up the error codes and they both pertain to ignition issues, 'Boiler failed to light' and 'boiler went out when lit'

Is there any chance he is actually correct or is this more likely to be, as the Glow Worm manual says, an ignition issue?

Agile · 16 Feb 2017

Ignition errors are unrelated to sludge in a system!

They can also be rather difficult for some engineers to diagnose. Perhaps he mainly installs boiler and is not very experienced at repairs.

You need an engineer who is competent at repairing boilers to come and repair it.

Sometimes ignition faults are as a result of less than careful maintenance. I wonder if that is the case for you.

When posting about boilers, please ALWAYS include the exact boiler model number!

Tony

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

Many thanks for your reply @Agile
Apologies for not including the boiler make / model. It is a Glow Worm 38cXi

FlyingFish · 16 Feb 2017

You need someone registered with a gas analyser to test combustion, working pressures and flue integrity, amongst a few other things.
Power flushing isn't going to fix an ignition fault.

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

FlyingFish said:
....test combustion...

Excuse me for being a bit thick but when I get either of the errors showing on the boiler (F1 or F4) there has been no combustion to test. Well not since before it produced the error anyway

The fault is also intermittent so I appreciate this makes it harder to diagnose.

FlyingFish · 16 Feb 2017

No offence but that's only as far as you know, a properly qualified and experienced gas engineer will know what to look for, and what to check, and whether something operates or sounds out of the ordinary. Which an unqualified diyer wouldn't be aware of. I'm not saying your wrong, but also you may not be right

Mick

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

No offence taken @FlyingFish You'll have to try harder than that Mick, if you want to offend me

The bottom line is that the manufacturer off my Glow Worm boiler have taken my money (£249) for a one of repair to my boiler and having changed one part, the fan assembly (after which the boiler worked for approximately 4 hours) now say they will not do anything else until my system has been powerflushed.

Since @Agile has said that

Ignition errors are unrelated to sludge in a system!

what should be my next line of approach. Every time I telephone them there is a queue in which I have to wait to speak to someone and this costs money each time. I suppose I really need the email address of the MD. I'm thinking about putting the credit card payment in dispute, that may get them phoning me

topgazza · 16 Feb 2017

If the system was supposed to have a regular flush and it wasn't done then, apart from who's fault is that, they are being pedantic in asking for it to be done even though its nothing to do with the fault. As its unconnected with the fault its moot although their refusal to revisit would be based on that contractual point. Same with the credit card if you have an issue with meeting all the terms of the sale.

Was a regular power flush a requirement of the sale/install and ongoing maintenance ? Seems unlikely and they can't insist on it. Check the T&Cs and if its not mentioned there as a condition then credit card for sure..... what a pain

Ask them to show where this is a requirement of a call out especially as its not remotely connected to the fault. Sorry if that's obvious but this sort of attitude winds me up

ianmcd · 16 Feb 2017

does it make a bubbling sound when it is running ?

FlyingFish · 16 Feb 2017

That's disappointing to hear it's the manufacturer fobbing you off. I'd phone and complain asking for a different engineer to visit. Or if you have it repaired by another qualified engineer, and it's not power flush related, you should be entitled to a full refund from Glow worm. Regardless of the fact they fitted a part. Is irrelevant as it didn't fix the fault.

Mick

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

@ianmcd No there is no bubbling sound (kettling I believe it's called) when it does fire up and ignite. When it ignites it's a super boiler.

@topgazza We purchased the property a year ago and as such it was not us that had the boiler installed so the sale & install was not us. We paid for a one off repair as we don't yet have it on a service agreement and obviously the manufacturer won't touch us now until it's been power flushed. Mind you if their answer to ignition problems is to get the system power flushed I don't think I want them near my boiler again once they've fixed it.

The engineer that came yesterday took a water sample from the boiler (when I was out of the room) and showed me lots of sediment in the sample but interesting I have taken numerous (yes many) samples of water from the boiler drain point today and all have been spotless, i.e. no sign of any particles big enough to see with the naked eye. The samples I have taken have been after varying periods of non use (turned off and then after showers etc. I think his sample bottle must have been contaminated somehow, I wonder how that happened?

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

@FlyingFish They won't entertain sending another engineer until I can prove my system has been power flushed, so not as simple as asking for a different engineer.

Doggit · 16 Feb 2017

If it was a power flush issue, then the boiler would work, but you'd have an operating boiler that was struggling to push the water round the system, so how would that cause an ignition issue. You may need to be blunt with them, and warn them that you will pass the problem on to trading standards, and the engineers details on to Gas Safe.

Boiler failed to light, and then goes out when lit, suggests a gas supply issue, so could be the flame failure device, and if a power flush can fix that, then I'm, well I don't know what I would be.

Advise them that you'll be getting another engineer, and then asking for a complete refund.

jeff the gasman · 16 Feb 2017

What Doggit said. Put the ball back in their court. Glow worm should re attend to sort the fault.

Needaholiday · 16 Feb 2017

I'll phone them tomorrow and wait a stupid amount of time in a queue while paying for the privilege. I will give them one more chance to re-visit my situation. If they do not agree a visit from a different engineer I will then place the credit card payment in dispute and contact trading standards. Unfortunately I cannot pass the engineers details to gas safe as he never left any paperwork but I will report it to them so they have an idea of the shoddy workmanship of one of their members.

Thanks for your help guys, really appreciated.

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Boiler help needed, I think I'm being taken for a ride :(

Doggit

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