carbon monoxide alarm bathroom

wez1981 · 8 Mar 2017

Hi we rent out my wife's old house. We were advised that all rooms with boilers and fires needed a carbon monoxide alarm. I bought a couple and installed. Last week the tenant called to say the bathroom one had gone off. As the gas boiler is in the bathroom I advised to isolate and called the plumber. After two hours checking he found nothing wrong.

He advised to move the alarm to the hallway. Just want confirmation this is ok, or can you get alarms that are ok in steamy air

Thanks
Mark

Dan Robinson · 8 Mar 2017

Steam in the bathroom will set it off.

Dan Robinson · 8 Mar 2017

And I suggest you reread the rules on carbon monoxide alarms...

What is the boiler make and model?

wez1981 · 8 Mar 2017

It is a puma potterton, which rules should be read is there a link. I now know that steam sets it off.
We are not professional landlords and just trying to do the right thing.
It is a Potterton Puma boiler from memory- old but fully serviced and seems to be reliable

Doggit · 8 Mar 2017

CO alarms are only needed for solid fuel fires, and for the old fashioned boilers that are open to the room. A sealed room boiler won't operate if there are any issues, so doesn't need one. Unfortunately, the "industry" is trying to push CO alarms for everywhere - even places they aren't needed. The Puma is a room sealed boiler, and should be fine

Do you have a smoke alarm on each floor, and do they have a 10 year battery that can't be removed by the tenant; and are you a member of a landlords association. I wouldn't recommend Angel smoke alarms though.

This is taken from the RLA website.

Carbon monoxide alarms
Additionally, landlords must ensure that there is a carbon monoxide alarm fitted in any room that is used partly or wholly as living accommodation which also contains any appliance which burns, or is capable of burning, solid fuel. This would include log and coal burning stoves and open fires, even if they are not normally in use, but does not include gas and oil boilers. If an open fireplace is purely decorative and not useable then it is not covered by the regulations.

Gas is not a solid fuel and so there is no requirement to fit one near a gas boiler. It is still advisable as best practice however.

FiremanT · 9 Mar 2017

Doggit said:
CO alarms are only needed for solid fuel fires, and for the old fashioned boilers that are open to the room. A sealed room boiler won't operate if there are any issues, so doesn't need one. Unfortunately, the "industry" is trying to push CO alarms for everywhere - even places they aren't needed. The Puma is a room sealed boiler, and should be fine

.

WRONG. Be careful when making safety relevant statements. If a flue seal fails, or as in some cases, collapses, CO can be released, and the boiler safety systems WILL NOT know. People have died as a result of failed flues, even with very modern boilers.

ianmcd · 9 Mar 2017

Doggit said:
CO alarms are only needed for solid fuel fires, and for the old fashioned boilers that are open to the room. A sealed room boiler won't operate if there are any issues, so doesn't need one. Unfortunately, the "industry" is trying to push CO alarms for everywhere - even places they aren't needed. The Puma is a room sealed boiler, and should be fine

Sorry Doggit but I totally disagree, if it is a rented property then it requires a CO monitor for a gas boiler , only cooking appliances do not require them

Stadan20 · 9 Mar 2017

Only needed for solid fuel afaik ,,,, but I always put a recommendation down to have one fitted if tenanted properties do not have one

Doggit · 9 Mar 2017

FiremanT said:
WRONG. Be careful when making safety relevant statements. If a flue seal fails, or as in some cases, collapses, CO can be released, and the boiler safety systems WILL NOT know. People have died as a result of failed flues, even with very modern boilers.

Being a Landlord myself, I go along with the regs as passed on to me by the landlords associations - as I added to the end of my post - but that's an interesting point you make Fireman. I suppose they do add at the end that's it's best practice to fit one, so I'm going to have to think about it now in light of your comments.

ianmcd said:
Sorry Doggit but I totally disagree, if it is a rented property then it requires a CO monitor for a gas boiler , only cooking appliances do not require them

But what about the article that I copied from the Residential landlords website, no offence intended. I need to keep up with these things, so I need to know whether I fit one out of choice (having seen Firemans comments) or whether I have to by legislation where i'm being given duff info. Help appreciated here please Ian.

ianmcd · 9 Mar 2017

My apologies Doggit, I have just read a few HSE documents for England and you are correct , there is no requirement for CO monitors in private rentals unless a solid fuel appliance is installed, they have been mandatory in Scotland since Dec 1st 2015, as all Landlords gas safety records now ask if a CO detector is fitted and if it is working or in date (depending on brand of certificate pad) I assumed that England had the same regulation

ianniann · 9 Mar 2017

Best practice is certainly to have a CO detector even for sealed gas boilers, but the regulations only require them for solid fuel. CO detectors are only required in living accomodation with solid fuel appliances. Bathrooms are specifically included in "living accomodation" but CO detectors are unsuitable for bathrooms, so that log fire next to the bath is going to have to go.

muggles · 9 Mar 2017

Doggit said:
CO alarms are only needed for solid fuel fires, and for the old fashioned boilers that are open to the room. A sealed room boiler won't operate if there are any issues, so doesn't need one.

Not true at all - the well reported death of Zoe Anderson in 2012 was as a result of CO poisoning from a faulty room-sealed boiler

Gasguru · 9 Mar 2017

Pumas are 20 years old and one of the worst boilers ever made....several parts are obsolete (pilot assemblies) so think about replacing soon.

Doggit · 9 Mar 2017

Play fair muggles, her death was from an incorrectly fitted flue, and the plumber got jailed for his lazy incompetence, so it wan't the boiler at fault, but yes a CO alarm would have alerted Zoe to the problem.

But I'm going to accept all the comments, and look again at fitting CO alarms.

Dan Robinson · 9 Mar 2017

Doggit said:
Play fair muggles, her death was from an incorrectly fitted flue, and the plumber got jailed for his lazy incompetence, so it wan't the boiler at fault, but yes a CO alarm would have alerted Zoe to the problem.

But I'm going to accept all the comments, and look again at fitting CO alarms.

The point being though, a leaking flue did not result in the boiler shutting down.

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carbon monoxide alarm bathroom

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