Any Ideas Please?

I am considering buying this first floor converted flat/studio but would like to turn it into a 1 bedroom flat. Ideally I would have liked to have put double doors between the two rooms, but I know this affects the Building Regs with inner rooms and I am mindful of the fire risk.
Does anyone know if I could put double doors in with a sprinkler system? Bearing in mind the bathroom is also an inner room? And if so what is the likely costs involved?



Many thanks

There's no issue of fire risk, and no sprinkler required. It'll depend on what you want to do, and how much you're prepared to spend, and if it'll increase the value of the flat.

I assume from the layout of the stairs, that there's another flat above you, and that there are chimney breasts in both rooms. If you could get rid of these, then you've already got a bigger flat, but you'd need to get the freeholders permission to do it. But the flat upstairs may be interested in doing the job as well. obviously, you can't guarantee on this idea if the chimneys were still in use by the downstairs flat.

You haven't give any sizes, but looking at the plan, I'd be inclined to put a lobby outside the toilet, and then have the bedroom at the front, and a kitchen/living room at the rear. You would then come into the living room, and turn left into the bedroom, so you'd build a wall from the front door across to where the chimney breast is You need a lobby outside of the toilet, but that corridor going to the toilet, is a complete waste of space.

It would be a pokey 1 bed, but it's be better than a bedsit, and you wouldn't need the double doors.

You'll need to take a builder in with you, but on the pretence of checking the place over. I've discussed development ideas before, and then found the flat was taken off the market, and they did the work themselves.

Thank you.

I like the sound of that! If I proceed and did that, I am wondering if I could squeeze a small kitchen into the middle part? As the middle wall was only partly knocked through and may look a bit odd.

I agree the corridor to the bathroom is a complete waste of space, but what did you mean by having a lobby?

If I'm correct on the building regulations, you can't go straight from the kitchen/living room into the toilet/bathroom; you need to have a small area that seperates them, which is called a lobby. If you put a door at the end of the corridor where it widens, then this would seperate the two areas. There's a small cupboard there, and then an empty space next to it. As you have no storage space in the flat, I'd make a cupboard to go the whole width.

The middle wall would get taken out (so you'll need to replace the carpet), but I don't think I'd go for a kitchen in the middle. If you took a wall from the doorway across to the chimney breast, you'd need about 5ft for a galley kitchen, and another 6" for the wall, and with about 10ft for the bedroom, you've then you're left with 9"6" for the living room. Now you might get away with 4ft6" for the kitchen, which give a 10ft living room, but that makes it a bit pokey. Putting up half a wall (or 2/3rds) between the living room and the kitchen might be a bit of a compromise, close off the cooker and sink, and make the living room feel a bit larger though. The other problem about having a kitchen in the middle of the house, is that you'll have the kitchen waste pipe running along the side wall of the living room, and you'll need to vent the kitchen, so youd have a square pipe at ceiling level as well - and that's assuming that you can cut through the chimney breasts.

Do you have the courage to knock on the the flats above and below it to talk about the chimney breasts, and see if the downstairs one is using it, or if the upstairs flat wanto to get rid of theirs - it's easy to do, and you'd need to do it under a bulding control notice (£144), but taking them out isn't difficult; it's labout to knocke them down, a pair of gallows brackets to hold the top part up, and then plaster the walls, and put the skirting boards back, then decorate the walls.

How much will the value of the flat increase being taken from a studio, to a 1 bed - hence you don't want to let on what you are going to do

Doggit said:

If I'm correct on the building regulations, you can't go straight from the kitchen/living room into the toilet/bathroom; you need to have a small area that seperates them,

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That would be correct for 1980, but not nowadays

Thanks for that Woody

Thank you for your help again.

I would consider the removal of the chimney breasts as it is a good idea, but to be honest at present the Freeholder owns all three flats and will eventually be selling them all, so I don't think they will want the expense or could be bothered to be honest

I have attached some pictures of the middle of the room that was only partially knocked through. Would I be able to knock more back without some kind of lintel? As that is the part that might look odd if I section off part of the front as a bedroom, I will have that section that I feel would be wasted and partly still enclosed but not part of either room. The other type of wall you can see towards the front of the room was part of a bed that was made and would be removed.

So having the kitchen in the middle sounds complicated, therefore if I rearranged it in the present kitchen area, would it matter to much if the base kitchen cabinets were placed in front of the window, which incidentally is very low? As there would be an escape route with the flat door. That way it would lend itself more of a small kitchen/lounge.

Everything is possible, it just depend on the costs; hence why you need to take a builder in with you. As the freeholders done the work, they won't be interested in doing any more, so you could ask them if they'd give you permission to take out the chimney breasts at some point, and get it in writing if they agree.. The kitchen can be repositioned against the window, but putting a board up against the lower part. Yes, you lose some of the light, but not enough to worry about.

You may need to leave a bit of a pier where the wall is, and then put in a longer lintel, otherwise you'd need to talk to the people next door, and issue a party wall agreement that means you'll repair any damage on their side if you stick the longer lintel in the wall.

You could leave that small wall sticking out to the depth of the chimney breast, and then put some shelving across it.

On the basis that the freeholders done the work, they haven't been very creative.

^woody^ said:

That would be correct for 1980, but not nowadays

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Provided the toilet has its own basin.

freddiemercurystwin said:

Provided the toilet has its own basin.

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Or there is one in the room the toilet is attached to.

Provided its not a kitchen, except that it is in this thread.

freddiemercurystwin said:

Provided its not a kitchen, except that it is in this thread.

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Where is that requirement stated?

The Building Regulations.

I tried looking through the building regs, but couldnt find the relevant section. But I came across this link which seems to suggest that the lobby is required due to there being a toilet in the bathroom.

But, on the basis that the kitchen could be laid out across the back wall, if there' is a lobby outside the bathroom, then that gives the kitchen a returrn of at least 600mm, and the door could then go across at an angle to the wall by the stairs, Problem sorted, argument over.

http://webarchive.nationalarchives....portal.gov.uk/uploads/br/br_pdf_ad_g_2015.pdf 4.9-4.10