A couple of photos of your consumer unit and incoming supply would help people to give you correct advice.
House electrics
- Thread starter Turnsnip
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It's by no means certain, or even possible, that there is anything wrong with your electrics, given what you have said.
But as a general note I would caution against assuming that working OK equates to being OK. There are things where you can't know without proper inspection and testing if they work until something goes wrong. "Everything is earthed", for example - you can't tell just from looking that the earth does "work OK". Then there are aspects which you can't know about even with testing, such as not finding out that there's a buried cable where it shouldn't be until you drill into it.
Yes - but, as I said, unless you have seen inside your CU and seen that only one cable goes to the MCB, you can't know whether it is a ring or radial circuit. If it were a ring and had multiple unfused spurs from spurs (which may be what you were describing), it could be potentially 'dangerous', and certainly contrary to current regulations.
Kind Regards, John
That's obviously true, and could be said of any electrical installation, but can only be (and, as you say, not completely) addressed by having the electrical installation fully inspected and tested.
However, as I understand it, the OP's only concern(s) were that there was only one sockets circuit in the house and possibly also that he may have a radial sockets circuits (I'm becoming increasingly confused/uncertain about that). Since neither of those are really valid safety concerns, the OP may have no specific reason (other than 'routine, to be sure') to have the installation inspected/tested.
Kind Regards, John
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But "mains" is low voltage.
Sigh
Kind Regards, John
Kind Regards, John
But low voltage is not necessarily "mains".
A bus is a vehicle, but not all vehicles are buses.
would you have said "But buses are passenger vehicles"?
Or are you only defective when it comes to your electrical obsessions?
I think spending a little money, to address your concerns would be wise.
Have you just moved into this property?
As already been mentioned, it is not unusual to come across an installation that has just one socket circuit, one lighting circuit, one cooker circuit and a circuit for immersion.
I would not mess with stuff you do not fully understand, establishing what is a ring final circuit and what is a radial circuit is not that difficult. You are evidently struggling with this or finding it difficult to explain exactly what you have.
Have you just moved into this property?
As already been mentioned, it is not unusual to come across an installation that has just one socket circuit, one lighting circuit, one cooker circuit and a circuit for immersion.
I would not mess with stuff you do not fully understand, establishing what is a ring final circuit and what is a radial circuit is not that difficult. You are evidently struggling with this or finding it difficult to explain exactly what you have.
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7/0.036 (4 mm²) and 7/0.044 (6 mm²) were both slightly larger than the metric cable which replaced them. Cable does not have a fixed rating it depends on how installed, but it is possible there was nothing wrong which what you had. As to if it's still OK after you have ripped out cables is another question, however the IET/BSi has for years stated the electrics of a home should be checked on change of occupant.
If you don't have it checked then you simply don't know if compliant or not. In the early 70's for domestic premises we had a peak of deaths due to electrocution, around 70 deaths per year, by 2013 this had dropped to 3, however it does not include deaths by fire caused by some thing electric. As to why it's hard to isolate, but I suspect earths on lights, and RCD's have helped.
The problem is because today it is so much safer, people are not as careful, and people do daft tricks, when my mother put an extension lead with red neon indicator in a bowl of water because she thought it was on fire, (92 with dementia) I realised time to get house re-wired and RCD protection fitted. In my own house when my son got interested in Amateur radio he passed his RAE at 15 year old, I fitted RCD's at home, early 1990's. My father-in-law still does not have them, all children do, so out of 6 houses in family only one without RCD protection.
If this is repeated nation wide no wonder we have a drop in deaths. However for fire we have very little to tell us what has happened, it is so easy, if you can't find a reason, call it electrical, so statistics don't help. It seems the London fire started with an electrical fault, but it was not the installation, and it was not really responsible for all the deaths.
You clearly have to assess the risk, however it was my father-in-law who still has no RCD protection who said to me, you will never forgive yourself if any of your children are injured because you have not fitted RCD's. Be it the garden pond, or RCD we don't take chances with out children, but it seems our spouse needs to look after them selves.
If you don't have it checked then you simply don't know if compliant or not. In the early 70's for domestic premises we had a peak of deaths due to electrocution, around 70 deaths per year, by 2013 this had dropped to 3, however it does not include deaths by fire caused by some thing electric. As to why it's hard to isolate, but I suspect earths on lights, and RCD's have helped.
The problem is because today it is so much safer, people are not as careful, and people do daft tricks, when my mother put an extension lead with red neon indicator in a bowl of water because she thought it was on fire, (92 with dementia) I realised time to get house re-wired and RCD protection fitted. In my own house when my son got interested in Amateur radio he passed his RAE at 15 year old, I fitted RCD's at home, early 1990's. My father-in-law still does not have them, all children do, so out of 6 houses in family only one without RCD protection.
If this is repeated nation wide no wonder we have a drop in deaths. However for fire we have very little to tell us what has happened, it is so easy, if you can't find a reason, call it electrical, so statistics don't help. It seems the London fire started with an electrical fault, but it was not the installation, and it was not really responsible for all the deaths.
You clearly have to assess the risk, however it was my father-in-law who still has no RCD protection who said to me, you will never forgive yourself if any of your children are injured because you have not fitted RCD's. Be it the garden pond, or RCD we don't take chances with out children, but it seems our spouse needs to look after them selves.
I've been and had a bit of a poke round tonight. There's been considerable work done upstairs in the past and it looks like an almost full rewire, professionally done by the look of it, very neat and tidy. The wire leading upstairs to a bedroom I'm guessing is old wire left in place m off a socket from the room below, on a radial circuit terminating at the next socket upstairs, the next socket downstairs is a spur. The rest of the upstairs which has all been rewired (and all the room layout juggled round, new stud walls etc) looks to be a ring circuit, with a radial feeding most the downstairs sockets and 2 up, with both circuits going into one 32a mcb, and the new sockets downstairs I mentioned at the end/start of the ring which then goes up. Only the old wire going up is a big old 4mm2 wire the rest are all 2.5mm2.
Didn't get to look in the back of the consumer unit at the wires as I hadn't got a normal screwdriver, the bit on my buzz gun wasn't long enough to reach the screws. But I'm certain I'll find 3 wires going in it.
I'll get someone round in time as I need a couple of things moving about, but for now I feel it's not as absurd as I thought it was at first when I saw that big old cable going upstairs.
All in all, jumped the gun a bit when posting this thread. I've just uncovered so many bodge jobs I flew off the wire thinking about a few grand I don't have on a rewire. But it doesn't look like this is one of them. Other than having two circuits on one breaker, isn't that a bit dodgy?
Although, the electric meter looks to be brand new so whoever fitted that must have been happy with what he found.
Didn't get to look in the back of the consumer unit at the wires as I hadn't got a normal screwdriver, the bit on my buzz gun wasn't long enough to reach the screws. But I'm certain I'll find 3 wires going in it.
I'll get someone round in time as I need a couple of things moving about, but for now I feel it's not as absurd as I thought it was at first when I saw that big old cable going upstairs.
All in all, jumped the gun a bit when posting this thread. I've just uncovered so many bodge jobs I flew off the wire thinking about a few grand I don't have on a rewire. But it doesn't look like this is one of them. Other than having two circuits on one breaker, isn't that a bit dodgy?
Although, the electric meter looks to be brand new so whoever fitted that must have been happy with what he found.
These are all assumptions and speculation, I find it hard to believe this can be established without. (1) looking inside the distribution box/CU and (2) doing some dead tests.
What evidence do you have of a recent rewire? I am insure if this is a recent purchase and proof of any historical electrical work has been given to you via documentation.
If so.
Just stating the facts as I see it, no intention to come across as impolite.
What evidence do you have of a recent rewire? I am insure if this is a recent purchase and proof of any historical electrical work has been given to you via documentation.
Was that directed at me?
If so.
Just stating the facts as I see it, no intention to come across as impolite.
I followed the circuits round, pulled the fronts off the back boxes and peered in. No end to the 'new' circuit, which has been redone as the sockets including boxes and wire are all newer. Brown blue and insulated earth compared to red, black and bare earth on the other. I couldn't find the end to the new circuit, the old bit I found where it terminates.
Either way, the circuit feeding the kitchen and utility room is short (about 16m of wire), and almost limited to the kitchen, feeding an extra socket in the living room and one of the bedrooms, both of which will se minimal useage, which is what I was most concerned about.
Yes recent purchase but no documents. Was done prior to the previous owners, who didn't have it all that long.
The presence of a new meter is totally unrelated to the condition of the installation.
People who install electricity meters only do that one thing - they do not test, examine or check anything other than the meter they are installing.
The rest of what you have found/looked at isn't significant either.
Blue/brown wiring just means it was installed at some point in the last 12 or 13 years.
Red/black may be older than that, or it was older stock that someone used more recently.
Sockets with two sets of wiring could be a ring, or it could be a radial and you didn't find the end. Or some other mess such as hidden junction boxes.
A socket with only one set of wires doesn't have to mean the end of a radial.
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