Extending garage roof (only) to extend overhang - PP required ?

shd1970 · 26 Jul 2019

I want to extend my garage roof "only" forward to increase the overhang to give a larger covered area, and wonder if anyone can confirm if i need PP.
The existing garage door is shown on the diagram below by the red dotted line. The current up and over garage door will be replaced with a new standard door type and will remain in approx the same place.
The black horizontal line shows the existing roof/overhang position
I would like to extend it forward as depicted by the green solid lines
It will not extend past the front my my house (left) but will need to come forward 1100mm of my neighbors property
Out of courtesy, i will obviously be asking my neighbor for permission to fasten joists to his property, but can anyone confirm if officially, this needs PP please ?

Many thanks in advance

shd1970 · 26 Jul 2019

Apologies, forgot to add as i think the height is relevant also, the existing height of my flat roof is 2450mm

Can anyone advise or shed any light please whether PP is required ?

Many thanks in advance

Leofric · 27 Jul 2019

shd1970 said:
Out of courtesy, i will obviously be asking my neighbor for permission to fasten joists to his property

More than just a matter of courtesy I think if you are building on to your neighbour's house

Are there any windows near the front corner of your neighbour's house?

tony1851 · 27 Jul 2019

Assuming the garage was original (or was built under a previous planning permission) what you propose would need planning permission as it is an enlargement which extends beyond a wall forming a part of the original front elevation, the 'wall' in this case being the existing garage door.

If the garage was a later addition built under permitted development, the canopy/carport would be permitted development as long as its width was less than half the width of the orginal house.

shd1970 · 27 Jul 2019

Thanks for the reply Leofric

Leofric said:
Are there any windows near the front corner of your neighbour's house?

The neighbors house consists of a 900mm pillar each side with a single large window forming the rest of the front of the house.
I'm not sure of the complete width of their house unfortunately

shd1970 · 27 Jul 2019

Thanks for the reply Tony

In reply to your points/questions :

tony1851 said:
Assuming the garage was original (or was built under a previous planning permission) what you propose would need planning permission as it is an enlargement which extends beyond a wall forming a part of the original front elevation, the 'wall' in this case being the existing garage door.

We have owned the house for 20 years and the garage has not been moved so assume it to be as per the original design or was erected by a previous owner
The replacement garage door will be fitted where the current door is place so strictly speaking the "wall" will be in the same place, its just the overhang/roof that i would like to bring forward

tony1851 said:
If the garage was a later addition built under permitted development, the canopy/carport would be permitted development as long as its width was less than half the width of the orginal house.

The width of the carport/garage is 2.5m so is less than half the width of the rest of the house

Can you explain why if its original, that it would need PP but if its current position is as per a previous PD, it could be extended forward under PD also ?
It seems the wrong way around to me

Thanks for taking the time to reply...much appreciated

tony1851 · 27 Jul 2019

shd1970 said:
Can you explain why if its original, that it would need PP but if its current position is as per a previous PD, it could be extended forward under PD also ?
It seems the wrong way around to me

The rule for enlargements at the front is that it is not permitted development if;

(e) the enlarged part of the dwellinghouse would extend beyond a wall which -
(i) forms the principal elevation of the original dwellinghouse; or
(ii) fronts a highway and forms a side elevation of the original dwellinghouse

By 'original dwellinghouse', they mean the house as originally built, or as it stood in July 1948 if it was built before then. Even if a wall (or in your case the garage door) is set behind the main front of the house, it is still regarded as forming part of the principal (ie front) elevation.

The fact that it is just a roof is irrelevent - so far as the rules are concerned, it is an 'enlargement'.

If there was no original side garage, then the rules for side extensions come into play, and you can extend up to the front of the house
without planning permission in that case, as long as the width of the extension is not more than half the width of the original house.

Seems crazy but them's the rules.

shd1970 · 27 Jul 2019

Tony,

Thanks for the comprehensive reply, much appreciated

Do you know if there is just one process for all planning applications or is there a quicker/simpler one for small changes such as this, as i would assume that it would be only my immediate neighbor that would be contacted as no one else is affected ?

Also, would BC need to be involved also please ?

Leofric · 27 Jul 2019

shd1970 said:
The neighbors house consists of a 900mm pillar each side with a single large window forming the rest of the front of the house.

So if your neighbour's window starts 900mm from the corner of their house the planners would have to consider your proposed roof extension would be blocking out light .

shd1970 · 28 Jul 2019

Thanks Leofric

Leofric said:
So if your neighbour's window starts 900mm from the corner of their house the planners would have to consider your proposed roof extension would be blocking out light .

Personally, i don't think that this will be a problem considering we are only looking to go out 1100mm and the size of their pillar before the window starts is 900mm
Also, my neighbors property is actually higher than us as our road is on a slope so my proposed roof would be visible at a height of 1.8m to them and they will simply see effectively just the height of a facia board and i propose a nice oak post to support that corner too with some greenery
The houses are North West facing too so it will not ever block sunlight
I have just checked our deeds and can see that there are a number of houses in our road where overhangs have been built over time, albeit, to the front of their adjoining neighbors house only (we are set forward of our neighbor hence our need for the 1100mm extension/green bit on my diagram)
So *assuming* that no one else went through planning permission for theirs (i cannot find any applications for those houses that have extended on the local planning portal), would that be a point for me to bring to the table and challenge planning on ?

Finally, can anyone confirm what the trigger is and dictates the need for BC to get involved please ?
As this is effectively a car port, i *think* that it is exempt from BC, correct ?

tony1851 · 28 Jul 2019

A conservatory, porch, covered yard, covered way or carport open on at least two sides and less than 30 sq m is exempt from building control.

shd1970 · 28 Jul 2019

tony1851 said:
A conservatory, porch, covered yard, covered way or carport open on at least two sides and less than 30 sq m is exempt from building control.

Thanks Tony !

Size will be approx 2.4m x 3.4m with 1.1m of the 3.4m being open on the neighbors side so assuming this qualifies, yes (not the entirety being required) ?

tony1851 · 28 Jul 2019

Common sense would assume so.

With it being relatively short, you could argue that it is not a true carport in that the average family car wouldn't fit entirely under it (eg if you extended it to say 5m to make it a true carport, the majority of the side would be open anyway).

It's down to how an inspector views it, but I suspect most would be realistic.

JohnD · 28 Jul 2019

shd1970 · 28 Jul 2019

JohnD said:
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Extending garage roof (only) to extend overhang - PP required ?

Leofric

Leofric

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