Justification for steel beam on half brick wall

Notch7 · 9 Dec 2019

mrrusty said:
Of course it shouldn't, and right is definitely on the OPs side. However, just trying to inject a little pragmatism into the debate because while you may have 100% right, it doesn't help if you then get bogged down in protracted litigation that drags on. Getting the job done must have a value in itself. As I say, not ideal, but you sometimes have to pick your fights.

I agree, a legal battle is not a solution on a job half done......

I had a customer whose son had a loft conversion and refurb done, by a 'specialist'. Unfortunately it turned into a disagreement because the job wasnt building regs compliant and the client refused to pay further installments. The result was the house was left with half the rooms unusable.

The problem wasnt the money, luckily the balance unpaid virtually covered sorting it out, by far the biggest issue was the 6 months of them living in a building site, no bathroom etc etc.

^woody^ · 9 Dec 2019

Hi.

Can someone tell me what's going on.

Thanks.

Dave 123 · 9 Dec 2019

tony1851 said:
But in this case, the additional load on the wall is absolutely minimal and I suspect the BCO/council checking engineer are being overly conservative, and your architect and SE are probably over-reacting to get the scheme approved on paper.

Is there a way around it then? The whole neighborhood has lofts built the way we planned ours, nothing is falling. Is there a different way to justify the structure other than with calculations? See the attached screenshots of the plans

tony1851 · 9 Dec 2019

Assuming the wall between the front bedroom and the stairs is 1/2 brick and bonded to the party wall, the floor area supported
by the steel beam is very small and the additional load on the 1/2 brick party wall minimal.
Can't see what the fuss is about really; in this instance, your builder seems to have more common sense than your architect, the SE, the bco and the council's checking engineer put together.

paulrockliffe · 9 Dec 2019

Are BC asking for calculations or do they want someone to inspect the wall and check it's OK?

The calculations you have assume the wall is vertical and that it is in good condition. A 100mm wall doesn't need to be much off vertical over 4-5m to leave the end the top brick sat completely outside the footprint of the bottom brick, how much lean can you have before the wall isn't suitable to take the loading? Your wall is probably lime mortar, if it's dry both sides then the mortar may be very dry and friable now, which can leave the wall in poor condition.

Not my area of expertise, just wondering if there's a slightly different requirement to justify the calculations.

Leofric · 9 Dec 2019

^woody^ said:
Can someone tell me what's going on.

Still confused ? Time to let the spaniel out, might even be a magic 8 ball job this one

Dave 123 · 9 Dec 2019

paulrockliffe said:
Are BC asking for calculations or do they want someone to inspect the wall and check it's OK?

They ask for justification, whatever this means. It could be calculations or a way to explain that the proposed structure works. Thats how I understand it

Dave 123 · 9 Dec 2019

paulrockliffe said:
100mm wall doesn't need to be much off vertical over 4-5m to leave the end the top brick sat completely outside the footprint of the bottom brick, how much lean can you have before the wall isn't suitable to take the loading

Something I didn't think about in this context, but yes I did wonder how far you can go before it's too high. I don't know if this is something that BC had in mind when they questioned the structure.

Leofric · 9 Dec 2019

It has to be sorted out by the SE , ask the SE whoever they are to discuss with the BCO exactly what needs to be justified. Is it the lateral stability of the existing half brick wall , the additional loading on the wall, the condition of the existing brickwork or what

ps re the note on the drawing referring to 'single course brick wall' - is that supposed to mean one brick or half brick thick wall

Dave 123 · 9 Dec 2019

Leofric said:
re the note on the drawing referring to 'single course brick wall' - is that supposed to mean one brick or half brick thick wall

Good point. I don't know what's the answer at the moment and I've noted that the reference to the single course brick wall is on both sides. Except when it's at the loft level and the wall on the left becomes thicker...?! Not sure what and why he did that

Leofric · 9 Dec 2019

Why is a chimney breast appearing on the proposed loft floor plan (and above a staircase

)when there is no chimney breast shown on the existing floor plans in that location

Dave 123 · 10 Dec 2019

Leofric said:
Why is a chimney breast appearing on the proposed loft floor plan (and above a staircase )when there is no chimney breast shown on the existing floor plans in that location

Previous owners removed the chimney breast, left about 800mm below the roof. So the chimney only appears at the loft level

Nakajo · 10 Dec 2019

And its mounted on gallows brackets?

Dave 123 · 10 Dec 2019

Nakajo said:
And its mounted on gallows brackets?

It is now..... someone did a cowboy job, there was some sort of support, but not sufficient (see the attached). Our builder temporarily fixed the gallow brackets, but eventually we are hoping to rest it on a steel and a post, to save some space. Just need to resolve the bigger issue of the half brick

Leofric · 10 Dec 2019

the new steel beam will support the post presumably

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Justification for steel beam on half brick wall

Notch7

^woody^

Dave 123

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tony1851

paulrockliffe

Leofric

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