How to work the heating and astronomical energy bills!

Hello Everyone!

Just looking for some advice on the heating system in our house and how to work it!
There is a Vaillant Ecomax boiler and Honeywell RF DT92E1000 Wireless Digital Room Thermostat - no programmer. The only way I have found to get the heating on is to turn the thermostat on at the same time as selected on the boiler clock, otherwise the heating will not come on at the selected times on the boiler clock.

Is the only way to get heating to physically turn on the thermostat in this set up? Is there anyway to get heating on, for example, in the morning without having to wake up, and turn the thermostat on?

Additionally, the gas and electricity bills have been astronomical around £300 per month combined gas and electricity, with a roughly 50/50 split between gas and electricity - I'm trying to work out why?? Switched energy supplier and still the same! Is it the boiler? Room thermostat is set to around 21-23°C when needed.

Any help is much appreciated, thank you

Edit: I forgot to mention that when the thermostat is turned on and the boiler fires up, the hot water is absolutely boiling!

Cable Tee said:

Is the only way to get heating to physically turn on the thermostat in this set up? Is there anyway to get heating on, for example, in the morning without having to wake up, and turn the thermostat on?

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yes set the timer on the boiler to come on at the times you want the heating on, and leave the thermostat set at the temp you want

ianmcd said:

yes set the timer on the boiler to come on at the times you want the heating on, and leave the thermostat set at the temp you want

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thank you ianmcd. So does this mean the boiler will constantly be on? Because I can still hear it whirring if the thermostat is on even if it is not the time to heat?

no the boiler timer should over ride the thermostat, if you turn off at the timer then the thermostat should not be able to bring the boiler on, remember that when you turn the timer off the boiler may make a noise for 5 mins or so as the pump over run comes in, but the flame icon shouldnt be on, if you have the HW pre heat or comfort set to on the boiler will fire every now and then with the timer set to off

ianmcd said:

no the boiler timer should over ride the thermostat, if you turn off at the timer then the thermostat should not be able to bring the boiler on, remember that when you turn the timer off the boiler may make a noise for 5 mins or so as the pump over run comes in, but the flame icon shouldnt be on, if you have the HW pre heat or comfort set to on the boiler will fire every now and then with the timer set to off

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Thank you so much, really appreciate it! I’m going to give this a go

Reading the instructions the thermostat has no time setting that is done by the programmer, the thermostat does have a eco and comfort and boost so it seems you could set it to turn up after so many hours, and so there is a work around, but not a very good work around.

The big thing about the Honeywell is they are reliable. You can get much cheaper thermostats, which I did for my mother, it had I think 6 setting per day, so instead of on/off it was set to different temperatures through the day, so cooler when she went to bed, but not completely off, however it went wrong, and I walked in the house and the heat hit me at 32°C.

So your looking at around £100 plus to replace with anything better. The likes of Hive, Nest, EvoHome, Tado are better, but expensive.

However the modern gas boiler has a lot built in, so it will reduce output when hot water returns, so the simple thermostatic radiator valve (TRV) will control it quite well, as each valve closes the water is either pushed through the remaining radiators or it lifts the by-pass valve so return water gets hotter and the boiler reduces output. The TRV on it's own will not completely shut down boiler, still need programmer or wall thermostat for that, but they will reduce the boilers output and so amount of gas used.

The standard TRV is marked *123456 and normally between 3 and 4 works out at around 20°C, the electronic type simply replace the old, and these can be set to change temperature by time of day and day of the week, so likes of the eQ-3 or terrier i30 can be set for your schedule for each room, turning the temperatures up/down as required. Your looking at £10 to £15 each from the internet, a little more if you want bluetooth so you can set with your phone. They are likely the easiest way to reduce bills without buying a new wall thermostat.

also worth noting
you do not say if it a new property or supplier
wiether its actual or estimated readings
or what has changed recently
you cannot form an accurate expectation formed on inaccurate information??

Get the kit changed as above. If you are paying £300pm then few hundred outlay is a drop in the ocean if it brings that bill down.

I have read some adverts for thermostats that say they use a mark space switching (it switches on and off) to prevent over shooting, however that means the boiler is repeatedly re-started, what is not plain is what a boiler does when it is stopped and restarted, does it restart at output stopped, or return to full output? So big question is although it stops over shooting does it stop it in a economical way? Sorry don't know answer.

But think the Vaillant boiler is designed for OpenTherm so be question is if the thermostat uses mark/space will it run economical?

Be it a car or boiler it will likely have a sweet spot where it runs the most economical, this likely changes model to model, but it is unlikely to be when running flat out, so it seems reasonable to think a modulating boiler should be allowed to modulate, be it TRV's or ebus thermostats, if designed to modulate, then fit it so it can modulate.

Upgrading or reprogramming the controls will only save you noticeable amounts of money if you find that your home is presently overheated or warmer than you want it to be. If this is the case, controlling it more accurately will allow the boiler to shut down before the house gets too warm and so stop energy being consumed unnecessarily. However, if this isn't the case, then new controls will have little or no effect on your energy consumption. I have installed new 'smart controls' to systems that already had a basic room thermostat, and the user has been disappointed to find they didn't notice any significant change to their energy consumption.

The best way to save energy is by insulation. Keep the heat that you have paid for inside your home and stop it escaping. Heating a property is like filling a bucket with water, if the bucket has a small hole and some water escapes you can keep it full with an occasional top up, if on the other hand it has a big hole, you would have to keep the tap running constantly to replace the water that is being lost. That's how it is with heating your home. The more heat you can prevent escaping the better.

I was wondering what has caused you to ask the question about your energy consumption? Has it suddenly increased, if so has something changed? On the other hand if it has always been that way, it may be that your home is poorly insulated so heat is being lost quickly.

This of course only relates to the gas consumption, the electricity consumption will be something else.

Cable Tee said:

I forgot to mention that when the thermostat is turned on and the boiler fires up, the hot water is absolutely boiling!

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Do you have a hot water cylinder?

If so, is there an electric immersion heater in the cylinder. If there is, has it been turned on by mistake?

If no immersion heater, is there a thermostat attached to the side of the cylinder? What temperature is it set to?