A history question on anti-freeze

M

mointainwalker

Joined
24 Aug 2009
Messages
2,651
Reaction score
278
Country
France
It's been a long time since concentrated anti-freeze was replaced by the diluted, ready-to-use product. Now silly as it seems, I was lying in bed last night and suddenly my brain threw up the question - WHY ?

I don't ever recall reading anything in the motoring-press about any legislation, and it does seem a retrograde step to increase shipping and storage costs for the diluted product which is mostly ordinary water.

Does anybody - particularly who was in the trade at the time - recall what sales pitch was given for this new type of product ?
 
Sponsored Links
I imagine a few factors have to be taken into account:
Economics.....they have made a lot of money selling water - the same applies to ready for use screen wash
Concentration..... changing a water pump for example often loses a fair volume of coolant but how much?
Ready made solutions take out the guesswork.
Engine materials......with so many differing metals / rubbers / plastics etc its increasingly important that the correct concentration of coolant is adhered to - likewise the formula of the coolant.

I still buy the concentrate though, but I am very careful to stick to a 50% mix.
John :)
 
Sponsored Links
Burnerman said:
Economics.....they have made a lot of money selling water - the same applies to ready for use screen wash
Concentration..... changing a water pump for example often loses a fair volume of coolant but how much?

I still buy the concentrate though, but I am very careful to stick to a 50% mix.
John :)
Click to expand...

I didn't know the concentrate was still available: I only ever see the diluted offerings in accessory shops. I don't understand your point about water-pups, John. Whatever you lose at that stage is diluted anyway, so what are you saying ?
 
JohnD said:
Mine is an OAT. I don't know if that's poisonous.

I have heard of people killing pets.
Click to expand...

Yes, that deadly sweetness. You may/may not recall that this was used about 15 or 20 years ago in a very big wine-scandal in Austria. Certain characteristics of the substance are similar to the chemical/physical characteristics of expensive wines- namely the "pure" sweetness and also the viscosity that makes the wine cling to the glass when it is swirled. Naturally they were not adding enough to harm people's health (not quickly at least ), but it put a very nasty dent in Austria's reputation.
 
mointainwalker said:
the diluted product which is mostly ordinary water.
Click to expand...

As far as I am aware, ready mixed anti-freeze (AKA 'coolant'), is mixed with distilled water which all manufacturers recommend for their engines. I use concentrate and good old tap water and so does everybody I know. Only time I’ve used distilled water was when I changed the coolant on my motorbike and even then it wasn’t technically distilled but de-ionised.
 
Last edited:
mointainwalker said:
I didn't know the concentrate was still available: I only ever see the diluted offerings in accessory shops. I don't understand your point about water-pups, John. Whatever you lose at that stage is diluted anyway, so what are you saying ?
Click to expand...
When the water pump is removed, a certain amount of dilute coolant escapes with it, so topping it up with a new but still diluted ready mixed mixture ensures the concentration remains the same.
Even when you do a coolant flush or drain down, there's always plenty left in the block or heater matrix so ready mixed stuff again keeps things stable.....always presuming people use the same make of coolant of course!
John :)
 
Right John, that makes sense. In your experience, can you say if there is a window ( mileage ) when pumps tend to fail on GM/Vauhall models. I ask because I will be having a cambelt change at 90,000 + on my Vectra C shortly, and am pondering whether to have the pump and the auxiliary belt changed at the same time ( for others, the pump was taken off the cam-belt drive on this model ). My only previous experience was with a Vectra B where it was changed at 85,000 and the pump was o.k. An inter-connected question* is, how much of the work changing the cam-belt is common to changing the pump.

I admit it is a bit lazy asking this* as I could work it out with the manual/Net, but since the initial question has led into it, I thought I would chance my arm :sneaky:
 
For sure, at that sort of mileage it makes great sense to change the pump.....its price is slight compared with the graft to get to it! The bearings may feel fine, but the seals must be past their best.
GM pumps are as good as any, the only one I’ve come across as poor was VAG stuff around 2000.......the plastic impeller used to fall off which was ridiculous. Ive seen PSA pumps with huge play but no leaks - the list goes on.
Replace the serpentine belt at the same time......if that snaps the strands get inside the timing belt cover and whip the timing belt off :eek:
If you go for a Gates belt kit, a quality water pump can be included, complete with gaskets and tensioner(s) all you need for a complete job.
Over here a firm called Autovaux is very popular and are well specialised.
Keep safe
John :)
 
IMG_20200415_103106714.jpg IMG_20200415_103059732.jpg
IMG_20200415_103059732.jpg
IMG_20200415_103106714.jpg
Autovaux is my regular supplier. When I bought my last set of items for change, I bought them separately because Gates didn't say whose pump was inside, so I did some digging and bought an o.e. quality pump. I don't recall the make , but it definitely had a metal impeller as that was something I required.

Staying safe ! Strict enforcement here. If outside your property, you either have to have a self-certifying form ( paper or electronic ) with date, time, address, reason for being out. Fine is otherwise € 135 and there have been over 500 000 handed out. Meanwhile the Parisian hordes* continue to flock into our mountain redoubt, swarming over the countryside like a plague of locusts and endangering us simple mountain-folk.

* There's probably one hiding behind one of those trees in the first picture!
 
Last edited:
That’s a very nice view. I wouldn’t mind self-isolating there for a few months. (y)
 
A fabulous place!
I don’t know the French Alps well but toured around the Chatel area on my motorbike, heading for Interlaken.
John :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Sponsored Links

Similar threads

A
EPDM novice advice needed
Replies
2
Views
690
cotswoldbuilders
C
H
Replacing two hot water cylinders with one
2 3 4
Replies
55
Views
2K
Johntheo5
J
G
  • Locked
  • Sticky
Wall and floor tiling basics
Replies
0
Views
105K
gcol
G
Back
Top