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chivers67 · 6 Jun 2020

Hi, had a friend ask me for advice regarding a Two Bed House he’s buying and doing up. Took some shots of the Incoming Power. It used to be a Bakery as a building but since been converted into three dwellings. TT with an old shared service head. It’s split at various places. He wants the meter moved under a set of Stairs. Think the DNO should be able to help with this matter before any further work is done. The cable from the Earth rod looks about 10mm. DB installed 2010 two circuits Sockets & Lights both on RCBOs inside a Five Way board (plastic). Lots of surface mounted cable wall papered over

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Taylortwocities · 6 Jun 2020

The DNO are THE ONLY folk who can move the meter. when you are doing that, request a PME (TNC-S) service. Then you can get rid of the rather shaky looking earth pipe. I guess that’s what the picture with the dishwash brush shows?
If that’s what it is, it needs renewing if you going to stay with TT. You need to check the Ze Of that. 10mm earth cable is ample, it’s only ever going to carry a maximum of 30mA!
It may need to be bigger if it’s unprotected. Check your OSG for details, but -really- try and get TNC-S.

chivers67 · 6 Jun 2020

I should have taken my Work Megger and Tested it, I'm hoping he can contact the DNO and get a new Service head put in with PME for sure and an Isolator after the meter too. The Feed is very old & odd how it's split for each property.

JohnW2 · 6 Jun 2020

Taylortwocities said:
The DNO are THE ONLY folk who can move the meter.

My understanding is that a DNO will not touch a meter (it's not even theirs to touch). They may well (for a price) move the service head/cutout, if that is required, but it would then surely be down to a supplier, or their subcontractor, to move the meter?

Kind Regards, John

Guitarguy · 6 Jun 2020

The DNO can move that to a new position, it’s an old wall box with either a split phase or three phase cutout inside feeding lead ins to each meter position. It may very well have a good earth connection back to the main so might be able to be used as TNS with an earth clamp on the lead sheath rather than PME. Obviously they’d have to test and decide that.
The DNO will move the cutout but can’t touch the meter- that is down to the supplier and they will have to be arranged to come on the same day and move the meter when the DNO have done their bit

Adam_151 · 6 Jun 2020

Guitarguy said:
that is down to the supplier and they will have to be arranged to come on the same day and move the meter when the DNO have done their bit

Generally, how difficult is that to arrange in practice? Because I can imagine it could be a right pain

SimonH2 · 6 Jun 2020

AIUI the DNO is allowed to move a meter. When I had a DNO engineer round at church, he did mention that we'd need to get our supplier to move ours (we were considering moving the service head & meter) as they don't like moving smart meters. The only reason for that is that they might not have a radio signal at the new location, and I imagine there then ensues some "discussion" as to who's fault it is that it no longer works as a "smart" meter

Taylortwocities · 6 Jun 2020

Oh yes apologies. I meant to State move of the service head is DNO responsibility.
Meter, these days, is I believe the responsibility of who the OP pays their lekky bill to.

SimonH2 · 6 Jun 2020

Yes, the meter is the responsibility of the supplier, but that doesn't preclude the DNO being allowed to move it. Lets face it, it's not complicated.
The implication I got from my discussion with the DNO engineer was that they'll move a "dumb" meter along with the service head - but they'll not move a "smart" meter in case it breaks the wireless connection.
I'm sure there must be a system in place to allow for the DNO and Meter engineers to do a co-ordinated move, could you imagine the complaints if there wasn't ?

Guitarguy · 6 Jun 2020

I’m not sure how easy it is, I guess it’s not too bad from jobs I’ve been on?
DNO aren’t allowed to move the meter at all anymore, used to back 7/8 years ago. Now not allowed to even take the terminal cover off or break the seal by rights!

SimonH2 · 7 Jun 2020

Guitarguy said:
Now not allowed to even take the terminal cover off or break the seal by rights!

I find that hard to believe - just think of the practical issues such a rule would cause. And there's a mutual interest in accurate metering since any theft would be lecky the DNO didn't get paid for. It would be perfectly logical for the DNO to open and reseal the meter terminals as well as the meter operator being able to open and reseal the cut out.
At church it was a good thing the DNO engineer could do that - whoever fitted the meter must have been a poorly trained monkey with no screwdriver to tighten the terminals (amongst other faults) - quite literally there were connections held in place by the set in the cable

Guitarguy · 7 Jun 2020

It is true as it’s not the DNO’s property. Obviously it is impractical, and isn’t really adhered to, say you’ve changed the cutout and moved the incoming meter tails potentially loosening them, you’d then check the meter terminals for tightness wouldn’t you?

SimonH2 · 7 Jun 2020

It doesn't matter that the cut-out isn't the property of the meter operator, and themeter isn't the property of the DNO - that doesn't automatically mean that one can't open and reseal the terminals on the other. Think about it, it is standard practice for meter engineers to open and reseal cutouts - it really cannot be that standard practice (as in every supplier sends out engineers without ever booking a DNO engineer at the same time) if it's not catered for in the rules.
So, if someone wants to state as a fact that "one can't touch the other's equipment" - chapter and verse please.

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