using wifi plugs for heating control..regs question from a Gas man!.

514.10 Warning notice: voltage
514.10.1 Every item of equipment or enclosure within which a nominal voltage exceeding 230 volts to earth
exists and
He's working on methods of controls for heating systems that operate at 230v.

there is no such thing as "Nominal voltage exceeding 230Volt"

Jesus, make up your mind.
Try reading the Reg you quoted,
If there is no such thing why does the Reg exist.

I think you need to educate yourself rather than insult others, Do you actually know what Nominal voltage to Earth is, even if he was fitting them on 400V 3 phase panels, even then your quoted Reg would not apply.
 
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Jesus, make up your mind.
Try reading the Reg you quoted,
If there is no such thing why does the Reg exist.

I think you need to educate yourself rather than insult others, Do you actually know what Nominal voltage to Earth is, even if he was fitting them on 400V 3 phase panels, even then your quoted Reg would not apply.


hahahahaahaha - what a laugh you are, you were obviously unable to read my response and so you spout more nonsense, you would argue forever over something you've made up in your head.
 
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Can you provide me with an example of where I would find a voltage exceeding 230V nominal to earth on a standard UK mains supply please.
 
Can you provide me with an example of where I would find a voltage exceeding 230V nominal to earth on a standard UK mains supply please.

RF doesn't like my detailed thoughtful response to his question, contractors hate detailed responses, and says all I needed to say was NO.

NO
 
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The way I see it is there could be 2 ways, separate and labelled circuits, the wifiplugs feeding just the motor and neutral, with the pair of switch wires going to 3a boiler supply, but this leaves a motorised valve with 2 points of isolation. Or, as I have , a double socket wired to the 3a boiler supply and labelled, '3a boiler controls only'

Interesting thread, but I cannot be bothered to read the entire argument - however...

My understanding is that yes you can have a 13amp socket or double socket used for a specific purpose working from a 3amp fuse, thus satisfying your single point of isolation. I have one such myself in my home - a single socket using a stair-lift charging supply, for a wall-wart charging a landline phone. I added a label on the socket 'FOR PHONE ONLY'.

Instead of Smart Plugs, you can use self contained Smart Switches, which can be fitted in a suitable plastic adaptable box - though they are a little more expensive.

You can also buy Smart Temperature sensors, able to report via wifi. All of this could be operated via Alexa and Alexa can provide the on/off time element.

My concern is that should the Internet, server, or wifi fail, then the system would have nothing to control it - the heating and hot water could run away with no control over it. In other words - if wifi contact or there is some other form of failure of communications, the Smart Switch will maintain its on or off state, until it receives an alternative instruction.

Really they need a 'watchdog' timer, frequently pinging base and if contact is lost, they should fail safe to off. I wonder if the commercial wifi based controllers incorporate such a watchdog? I included one in an micro-based system I designed some 40 years ago.
 
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Be warned, you have mentioned use of mains voltage, so did I, and that is what made someone apoplectic, and started all this nonsense.
 
514.10.1 Every item of equipment or enclosure within which a nominal voltage exceeding 230 volts to earth

So it seems to say - warning notices are only required if the voltage exceeds 230V, and if the voltage is below 230 warning notices are not required. I know the IET don't mean that, but that's what it says.
That is not what it says because they didn't mean that.

It refers to the 'nominal voltage'.

The actual permitted voltage in the UK varies between 216 and 253, but most of the UK is 240, including my place.
What is the nominal voltage in your place?
 
they should fail safe to off.

It maybe that fail safe state is ON such as lighting. Hence units should have options about what to do iif pings cease to arive

I wonder if the commercial wifi based controllers incorporate such a watchdog?

Any safety critical installation should have a control function and a separate monitoring function. And maybe a totally separate back up system.

If the WiFi based control and monitoring systems cannot keep the room warm then an electric heater with it's own thermostat could be the back up system to prevent the room becoming hazardously cold.
 
So it seems to say - warning notices are only required if the "NOMINAL" voltage "TO EARTH" exceeds 230V, and if the "NOMINAL" voltage "TO EARTH" is below 230 warning notices are not required. I know the IET don't mean that, but that's what it says.
.

Yes that is what it says, so why cant you just admit your wrong?

It actually says Nominal voltage of 230 Volt to Earth, it was you who initially quoted it.

You have the IET phone number , maybe you can phone and tell them.
Instead of wrongly advising people to stick on unnecessary warning labels, I take it then you have labelled every appliance in your house.

The IET phrase (nominal voltage exceeding 230 volts to earth) is ridiculous, because any voltage above or below 230 is not nominal, and if that phrase is incorrect, that means any voltage can be nominal. But the IET state nominal voltage is 230V

Best tell them to Delete Table 41.1 as well
But the IET state nominal voltage is 230V

Really, where do they state that, certainly not in the Regs book
Definitions, Nominal Voltage, nope
Symbols, Uo, nope
C'mon Sparxxx, educate us, He can't
 
Yes that is what it says, so why cant you just admit your wrong?

It actually says Nominal voltage of 230 Volt to Earth, it was you who initially quoted it.

You have the IET phone number , maybe you can phone and tell them.
Instead of wrongly advising people to stick on unnecessary warning labels, I take it then you have labelled every appliance in your house.



Best tell them to Delete Table 41.1 as well


Really, where do they state that, certainly not in the Regs book
Definitions, Nominal Voltage, nope
Symbols, Uo, nope
C'mon Sparxxx, educate us, He can't

I'm no longer interested in your nonsensical comments, due to your inability to understand english.:D
 

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