non display of vehicle excise duty
- Thread starter dippergir
- Start date
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Why was the disc not on the screen?
I assume you had a ticket for the car park? If you did then yes you go to the council and so them your valid ticket and they will clear the fineJust been hit with a £60 fine by a traffic warden in a car park at 10.25am on the 1st of the month in a council car park.. is this simply an over zealous traffic ... warden can I appeal
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Unfortunately, failure to display a current tax disc is an offence even if you've paid the tax; you can even be fined for displaying the disc in the wrong place on the screen, or upside down.
No infringement of the rules is too small for quota-driven, petty-minded bureaucrats.
No infringement of the rules is too small for quota-driven, petty-minded bureaucrats.
Who is the fine from ?
A traffic warden cannot fine you for not having road tax can he/she ?
I've been stopped twice by police while waiting for the DVLA to end a disc through (I'd bought online).
Never had a fine.
I'd appeal it if I were you. Ask what jurisdiction the warden has for issueing the ticket on council property .
When it comes to local councils - they'll try anything to make some money.
A traffic warden cannot fine you for not having road tax can he/she ?
I've been stopped twice by police while waiting for the DVLA to end a disc through (I'd bought online).
Never had a fine.
I'd appeal it if I were you. Ask what jurisdiction the warden has for issueing the ticket on council property .
When it comes to local councils - they'll try anything to make some money.
It's not clear from the original posting what type of person issued the ticket.
However, car parks are not, generally, 'public roads' for the purposes of vehicle excise duty [road tax]
Vehicles parked on public roads can be issued tickets for non-display of a vehicle excise licence [VEL] by a number of persons including [proper] traffic wardens and police personnel.
I am not aware that, even in Scotland, this power has been extended to local council wardens but that may be the case.
In any event, if the car was parked in a car park then, as I said, this is generally NOT a 'public road' and the offences under the 1994 Act do NOT apply.
HOWEVER, some council run car parks have a requirement to display a valid VEL within the terms and conditions of using the said car park. These terms and conditions should be displayed or readily available on request.
So, basically, you have two issues to look at.
Was the car park a public road [unlikely]?? If so then the offence is committed BUT you would then have to find out if the warden has the power to issue the ticket for a 'public road' non-display.
Does the car park have display of a valid VEL as part of its terms and conditions? If so then the council can have their own wardens issue tickets for contravention.
I think the latter is the most likely scenario. Ask to see a copy of the terms and conditions of use of that particular car park. If the requirement is in there then, in the words of the prophet, you're cattled....
However, car parks are not, generally, 'public roads' for the purposes of vehicle excise duty [road tax]
Vehicles parked on public roads can be issued tickets for non-display of a vehicle excise licence [VEL] by a number of persons including [proper] traffic wardens and police personnel.
I am not aware that, even in Scotland, this power has been extended to local council wardens but that may be the case.
In any event, if the car was parked in a car park then, as I said, this is generally NOT a 'public road' and the offences under the 1994 Act do NOT apply.
HOWEVER, some council run car parks have a requirement to display a valid VEL within the terms and conditions of using the said car park. These terms and conditions should be displayed or readily available on request.
So, basically, you have two issues to look at.
Was the car park a public road [unlikely]?? If so then the offence is committed BUT you would then have to find out if the warden has the power to issue the ticket for a 'public road' non-display.
Does the car park have display of a valid VEL as part of its terms and conditions? If so then the council can have their own wardens issue tickets for contravention.
I think the latter is the most likely scenario. Ask to see a copy of the terms and conditions of use of that particular car park. If the requirement is in there then, in the words of the prophet, you're cattled....
A similar thing happened to a mate of mine a few years ago, he got a parking ticket issued for parking an untaxed car on a public car park. He contacted the council and told them where they could stick it and they backed down.
the police can check on the dvla database to see whether you have currant ved,but traffic wardens cannot unless they have a pocket computer so they will issue you with a ticket so you end up appealing against it.
I would say the carpark is public if it's open to the general public, as is a pub carpark till the pub has shut, it then becomes private.
But, with that in mind, if it's public, wardens phone police, they can clamp or take it, can't they? or some clamping firm will? is it still legal?
But, with that in mind, if it's public, wardens phone police, they can clamp or take it, can't they? or some clamping firm will? is it still legal?
The definition of a 'public road' under The Road Traffic Act 1988 is different from the definition used by Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 [which governs excise licences] Hence, although offences under The RTA 1988 may well be committed in car parks, petrol forecourts etc. the offences relating to vehicle excise licences fall into a different definition viz.
Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 (c. 22)
“public road”—
(a) in England and Wales and Northern Ireland, means a road which is repairable at the public expense, and
(b) in Scotland, has the same meaning as in the [1984 c. 54.] Roads (Scotland) Act 1984
From the DVLA themselves, the advice on untaxed vehicles states;
If you see a vehicle on the public road (car parks, driveways or housing association parking spaces don’t apply) with an out of date tax disc, you can report it online, by telephone or by post. You don’t have to give your name. Your report will be investigated and enforcement action taken, if needed.
In London, there still exist police traffic wardens as well as local council wardens. Police traffic wardens can issue notices and have access via radio to The Police National Computer just the same as police officers.
Police traffic wardens and police officers have always been able to report untaxed vehicles to The DVLA. In recent years, police traffic wardens have also been able to issue penalty notices for non-diplay of VEL [Before that only police officers could issue such a penalty notice]
I am not aware that the power to issue tickets for non-display of VEL has been legalised for local council wardens albeit, just like joe public, they can report untaxed vehicle to The DVLA.
Therefore, I would suggest that the offence under Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 is not committed in a car park such as the OP parked in and, in any event, even if it was the local council warden could not issue a ticket for it.
I think it far more likely that the car park terms and conditions enshrine a need to display a valid VEL and any breach of these car park terms and conditions would enable the local council warden to issue a ticket for contravening the car park terms [as opposed to the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 offence]
Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 (c. 22)
“public road”—
(a) in England and Wales and Northern Ireland, means a road which is repairable at the public expense, and
(b) in Scotland, has the same meaning as in the [1984 c. 54.] Roads (Scotland) Act 1984
From the DVLA themselves, the advice on untaxed vehicles states;
If you see a vehicle on the public road (car parks, driveways or housing association parking spaces don’t apply) with an out of date tax disc, you can report it online, by telephone or by post. You don’t have to give your name. Your report will be investigated and enforcement action taken, if needed.
In London, there still exist police traffic wardens as well as local council wardens. Police traffic wardens can issue notices and have access via radio to The Police National Computer just the same as police officers.
Police traffic wardens and police officers have always been able to report untaxed vehicles to The DVLA. In recent years, police traffic wardens have also been able to issue penalty notices for non-diplay of VEL [Before that only police officers could issue such a penalty notice]
I am not aware that the power to issue tickets for non-display of VEL has been legalised for local council wardens albeit, just like joe public, they can report untaxed vehicle to The DVLA.
Therefore, I would suggest that the offence under Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 is not committed in a car park such as the OP parked in and, in any event, even if it was the local council warden could not issue a ticket for it.
I think it far more likely that the car park terms and conditions enshrine a need to display a valid VEL and any breach of these car park terms and conditions would enable the local council warden to issue a ticket for contravening the car park terms [as opposed to the Vehicle Excise and Registration Act 1994 offence]
A while ago I had my firm's van parked up outside the house, waiting for the tax disc to arrive in the post (first working day after a week off, bank holiday weekend etc.etc.).
Got a knock on the door from a young WPC who pointed out she had noticed the road tax had expired. She suggested I moved the van about five yards, and park on the other side of the road.
There are no parking restrictions, but the parking places on one side of the road were considered to be on the public highway, and the spaces on the other side were in bays, and considered not to be on the road....but to wait until she couldn't see me move it, 'coz it's an offence to drive without a current tax disc displayed.....
Maybe there are still some good coppers out there.
Got a knock on the door from a young WPC who pointed out she had noticed the road tax had expired. She suggested I moved the van about five yards, and park on the other side of the road.
There are no parking restrictions, but the parking places on one side of the road were considered to be on the public highway, and the spaces on the other side were in bays, and considered not to be on the road....but to wait until she couldn't see me move it, 'coz it's an offence to drive without a current tax disc displayed.....
Maybe there are still some good coppers out there.
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