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Earth lead attached to radiator

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by rubble2, 9 Sep 2020.

  1. rubble2

    rubble2

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    I'm in the throws of a bathroom refurb and took the old radiator off the wall this morning. I found this earth lead feeding in from the bedroom next door and attached to the rim of the radiator by a clamp (the paint on the radiator was intact so I am not sure how good a connection it was making).

    I have never come across this before and wondered if I need to re-attach it to the replacement radiator (towel rail actually) or if I can just cut it back?

    I have no objection to attaching it again but wondered how necessary it is?

    House was built about 18 years ago if that is significant.

    Thanks
     

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  3. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    It is not necessary.
    It would be best to find the other end and disconnect it

    What is that pipe in the picture?
     
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  4. rubble2

    rubble2

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    Thanks,

    Pipe in the picture is the waste from the hand wash basin
     
  5. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    Ok.

    Is the radiator fed by copper pipes?
     
  6. rubble2

    rubble2

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    Yes copper pipe
     
  7. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    It is possible that the pipes might need bonding (joining together electrically - by green & yellow cable) - or they might not; it depends.
    This could be done anywhere that will achieve the desired result so might be done out of sight.

    If you have RCDs covering all the circuits in the bathroom then this bonding is not needed.
     
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  8. ericmark

    ericmark

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    Bonding is so all parts are the same voltage, what ever the voltage is does not really matter, and in the late 60's early 70's we went mad, even metal window frames were bonded, but this has been slowly relaxed over the years, the is also a risk with bonding, so in 2008 with the introduction of all RCD protection much of it was dropped.

    The death of Emma Shaw showed the problem with earthing, had the walls been earthed or the water pipes not earthed she would not have died, and the RCD means that could not happen with an insulation designed today.

    The shaver socket shows how not being bonded or earthed can increase safety, but in the main we take the attitude if unsure then earth/bond. It is unlikely the radiator needs bonding, and if you have RCD protection likely better if not bonded, however I would not stick out my neck and say not required unless all RCD protected or supplied with plastic pipes.

    The worry is not something in bathroom, it is something outside the bathroom making the pipes live.
     
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  9. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    Call it mad if you want.
    It was just that more mistakes were made because of lack of knowledge.

    No, they were earthed unnecessarily - like the OP's radiator.

    No, it hasn't. Some people no longer do it wrongly.

    No, it wasn't.
    RCDs just make the criteria for bonding to be necessary virtually impossible to be the case.
     
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  11. SUNRAY

    SUNRAY

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    Sadly this is one of those uncommon situations where I feel I need to disagre with you EFL. In the 70's and even into 80's any new installation would be inspected by SEEBoard and they would not make the connexion if metal items were not bonded, even metal door/window handles & Hinges and coat hooks. They went round with a long wire to test all and sundry. I did a fair bit if work for a builder and it got to the situation that some items were deliberately delayed until after the power was on.
    Bathrooms were examined to ensure that every pipe entering the space were bonded, if a copper pipe such as rising main water under the floor had several branches each branch had to have a seperate bond. Whether needed for safety or not, without them power would not be connected. On the new builds it was quite rare to have power connected on the first SEEBoard visit as they'd usually find something had been missed. I suspect this may have been one of the reasons for the proliferation of plastic door and window furniture.
     
  12. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    In that case, it was SEEBoard who were mad and ignorant and electricians doing what they know is wrong.

    Did no one ever query it?

    The regulations did not call for it and are virtually the same as they are today.


    Physics has not changed either,
    .
     
  13. SUNRAY

    SUNRAY

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    I can't quote the regs as I don't have a copy but it either stated, OR what was stated was interpreded as, 'all exposed metal', That's certainly the way SEEBoard viewed and enforced it.
     
  14. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    Then, they were wrong.

    Someone (Securespark?) recently posted the infamous 15th regulation, in a similar discussion, and it was virtually the same as today.
     
  15. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    Anyway, as I said, the physics hasn't changed so even if the regulations called for such (misplaced and misnamed) bonding, then it would have been the regulations which were wrong.
     
  16. SUNRAY

    SUNRAY

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    I'm happy to accept there may have been errors and/or misunderstandings etc but the simple fact of the matter is as I mentioned before -if the bonding wasn't done the service was not connected - simple and straightforward, we knew where we stood and had to do it.

    Commercial work was even worse, I recall having to bond some very silly brackets etc.
     
  17. RF Lighting

    RF Lighting

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    Sorry but that seems like very bad advice. If it forms part of the supplementary bonding, and the installation doesn’t have sufficient RCD coverage, which is very likely in a house built in 2002, then that bond is very much required.

    A blasé just chop it off could leave the homeowner with a dangerous installation.
     
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