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EICR - C2 - circuits 1 and 2 low insulation resistance reading

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by dpm_dpmartin, 12 May 2021.

  1. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    The top of the column states 'MΩ', so whatever he 'thinks' he has written > and < 1000MΩ.
     
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  3. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    Indeed, we know that, but people are speculating about possible 'explanations' for what we're seeing.

    Don't forget that he also wrote to the OP "Anything less than the 1 meg is a fail so if it says less than thats cos it is" - which seems to indicate that he does reasonably correctly understand the interpretation of IR results, despite what he's written on the form.

    Kind Regards, John
     
  4. dpm_dpmartin

    dpm_dpmartin

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    This comment is interesting. Some way through the set of EICRs he was doing for me, he had to postpone one... he WhatsAppd me a picture of a crime number and then rang me to say that his van had been broken into and he needed to cancel the EICR that day, we chatted about it and I commiserated with him for a while - I now recall him making some comments about "insurance troubles" - but he also said he'd be back up and running fully, with all new gear, in around 10 days or something, so I thought nothing of it... he did complete another passing EICR for me in the meantime, I note "<1,000MΩ" which is fine, and then he eventually did this one with the <1,000MΩ recordings in May, then he quoted me the £3,550 for the full re-wire on a 2 bedroom terrace... and he absolutely refused to contemplate any other remediation route forward.

    I doubt I'll ever know if this all arose from that experience for him.

    It was his initial adamant position about a re-wire (and having an empty property) that encouraged me to ask about the C2 on here. I was looking for someone to say - "nah, there's other things you can do, have you suggest this to him?" or "sure, he's dead right, low IR always implies a re-wire and we always have the property empty for that". Plus the re-wire cost seemed high (I've only ever done one before, that was way back in 2016 on a 3 bedroom house, but it wasn't anything like that price)... it all started to feel a bit fishy as more and more information came to light - and then he became a bit aggressive when asked some polite questions.

    You have to go with your instinct (although mine is obviously not that great to begin with). Now I have the headache of getting someone else in and now I'm going to be eagle-eyed for things... I don't think this property is especially problematic. It's old, sure. But the Tenants have never reported any actual issues with the electrics. The EICR now seems wrong on so many levels, as you guys have helpfully pointed-out. I have learned a lot, thank you.
     
  5. blup

    blup

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    Can you let the forum know the outcome in due course.

    Blup
     
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  6. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    Yes, I understand that, from a similar comment you recently posted in relation toa post from EFLI.

    However, this one from me consisted of only 5 sentences, necessarily containing 7 instances of the "<" character and 6 instances of the "Ω" character (neither of which is Chinese or Russian), two 'one line' quotes and one smilie - the remainder being standard ('English'!) alphanumeric characters. Is that really enough to trigger the software's 'suspicions'?

    Kind Regards, John

    MOD: Your report has been assigned to the relevant person who will look at the moderation queue criteria and determine whether or not they need adjusting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 15 May 2021
  7. dpm_dpmartin

    dpm_dpmartin

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    I hope - fingers-crossed - I have another Electrician, Sheffield-based, who will go in and do the necessary checks. I've spoken to him today for almost 15 minutes and I've made him aware of the background story here - he seemed reasonable and said similar things to what people have posted here. Yes, it might still be low IR... but then I've rammed home that I'd be looking for the most pragmatic approach to remediation. He seemed OK with that. I've shared the EICR (contact details blanked) with him. I've also - just - managed to speak to the Tenant who is now a lot happier I'm getting a second opinion... we've agreed that even if we do end up at re-wire stage we will all work to ensure she can stay (even if she's out completely during the days - she understand, now, what the job can be like!).

    I think people have commented here on potential ways of investigating, localising and remediating low IR if confirmed. I will need to re-read those bits I think.
     
  8. dpm_dpmartin

    dpm_dpmartin

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    I forgot to add... the Tenant relayed to me, unbidden, the fact that the Electrician almost left the property because she had temporarily removed the handle from the door to the cellar and he couldn't easily get down there... so he almost kicked-off and told her something like - "forget it, I'll just take a photo and show the Landlord I couldn't get access" - then, when she got the door open, in a few seconds according to her, he asked her how much rent she was paying, then turned his nose up and said - "you can do a lot better than this for that money, why are you still living here?" - which is interesting, because I'd been on Rightmove looking at exactly that, thinking I could try to help her out a bit if it came to it, and there actually is a scarcity of properties in that area (which she wants for the school), in fact only 2 similar ones at £150 more per month. It feels, to me, now, like he is just a hothead.
     
  9. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    That all sounds good.
    I don't think there's been a lot of discussion about that yet since, frankly, we have yet to be convinced that there necessarily is any 'low IR issue' that needs to be addressed.

    However, if the new electrician does confirm that there are low IRs which need attention then, if he doesn't himself come up with reasonable ideas about "potential ways of investigating, localising and remediating low IR if confirmed", then if you let us know, we can probably make further suggestions. However, from what you've said it would seem quite likely that the new electrician will not "need our help" in that respect!

    Keep us posted!

    Kind Regards, John
     
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  11. blup

    blup

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    LOL at the notion that JohnW2 is under suspicion of being a foreign body.

    Blup
     
  12. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    Whatever your past experiences and relationship with him, it certainly sounds as if you are "well rid of him" :)

    Kind Regards, John
     
  13. blup

    blup

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    It's quite common for electricians to report limitations on what they have not been able to do, i.e. access to the cellar.

    Blup
     
  14. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    Quite so - but not just me, EFLI as well, it seems - maybe the pair of us constitute some sort of "terrorist cell" :)

    Kind Regards, John
     
  15. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    It is - but the issue here is presumably about 'attitude' in general?

    As has been said , IF (despite what has been recorded on the EICR), there are circuits with low IRs that need attention, the most unreasonable things seem to be that the guy was seemingly adamant that a complete re-wire would be the only possible solution and that even that he could only do if the flat were vacated by the tenant.

    Kind Regards, John
     
  16. Adam_151

    Adam_151

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    If this chap is of the mindset that he thinks its acceptable to convince the customers of his client that they'd be better off not being so then I shouldn't imagine you'll have to worry about avoiding him for furture jobs for long, he won't be in business long
     
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  17. JohnW2

    JohnW2

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    Many thanks.

    If it were possible, it would probably make sense in this particular forum to exclude from the "moderation queue criteria" those non-alphanumeric characters which are fairly likely to be used here - in particular <, >, Ω, Δ, π, μ, ° etc. It seems that superscript symbols, such as ² (very commonly use for cable/conductor CSAs) is already immune from causing this problem.

    If that is not possible, maybe another approach which might be possible would be to exclude posts from 'trusted members' (however defined!) from this process? (it does seem to be, over time, that it commonly happens to EFLI and myself).

    Kind Regards, John
     
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