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Hardwired Doorbell chime wiring

Discussion in 'Electrics UK' started by sleptwithatradesman, 21 Dec 2012.

  1. sleptwithatradesman

    sleptwithatradesman

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    Hi,

    I'm trying to replace my hardwired doorbell chime.

    The existing one is wired in to the lights and has a built in transformer.

    I bought a replacement that requires 240V & the signal from the button.

    The old one had 3 cables going to it and when I removed it to paint the wall it was attached to I assumed 2 would be the power (being on the lighting ring) and 1 would be the signal wire from the button.

    When I disconnected the old one I stuck the wires into a terminal block the same way they were into the old chime.

    Weeks later I've went to wire it into the new chime and the wiring has me confused. There are 3 x 2 core cables that all look the same cross section. All are brown & blue. The 3 browns (lives?) were wired into 1 terminal on the old one and the 3 blues are labled 1, 2, 3 and semingly went into separate terminals.

    Anyone shed any light into wtf is going on?

    cheers!
     
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  3. big-all

    big-all

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    have you got a picture
    i thought they where all 8- 12v with a transformer near the the mains input :eek:
     
  4. sleptwithatradesman

    sleptwithatradesman

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  5. ericmark

    ericmark

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    A lot of guess work I think old one was the standard 8vac where the new one is 230vac so new supply will be required.

    But I wonder why three cables?
    One would be 8 volt feed and another would connect to bell push but third no idea unless it has two bell buttons.

    I had one with two bell buttons and also an extension speaker wired to both front and rear door with option to use transformer or batteries.

    However my wife even with extension speaker in the kitchen still missed the postman so have replaced with wireless type from Lidi three one in kitchen one in living room and one outside bedroom door all work from same push button. Although batteries do run out not three together so old one no longer used. Pity played carols at Christmas.

    If you are going to use on from the existing transformer do check voltage. 4, 8, 12, and 16 volt all common also some AC and some DC so will need to match supply.
     
  6. sleptwithatradesman

    sleptwithatradesman

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    Cheers

    The old bell is a 'Friedland'. I'm pretty sure it has a built in transformer meaning the feed must be mains.

    Do you see the size of it in the photo ? it's a monster.
     
  7. OwainDIYer

    OwainDIYer

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    "pretty sure" isn't really good enough when you're possibly mixing mains and extra-low-voltage wiring.
     
  8. bernardgreen

    bernardgreen

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    Good and essential advice.......

    I did come across a door chime with built in transformer. It had been wired with the door bell push switching the live to the transformer. It could have been fatal had the push not been in a closed porch where rain could not reach.

    That old chime does look like it has a built in transformer. The more common version is battery operated and has spaces for 4 D size cells. The one in the picture appears to have a block, about the size of a suitable transformer, in place of two of the cell holders.

    (( a single cell is not a battery, two or more cells linked together make a battery ))
     
  9. Sureitsoff?

    Sureitsoff?

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    That old chime does indeed look like a freidland(looks similiar to mine in fact) which is wired from a seperate 12V transformer to two terminals and the push is wired to a third terminal and one of the supply. If it is the same as mine it can also have a second push wired to the fourth terminal and the supply. The second push sounds differently to the first push (for a side door for example)
     
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  11. sleptwithatradesman

    sleptwithatradesman

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    Sorry about my vagueness.

    To Clarify:

    The Chime has a built in transformer, I've opened it.

    It is stamped 'Friedland'

    Does anybody have an idea why 3 separate cables would have the brown/live tied together and the the 3 other cores going to 3 separate terminals.

    Thanks.
     
  12. bernardgreen

    bernardgreen

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    This is probably what is there.

    Two of the cables are mains voltage. one brings the power to the transformer and the other takes power on to other lamps etc .

    The third pair will be the ELV ( extra low voltage ) 8 or 12 volts to and from the push on the door.

    It is bad practice to use mains type cable for ELV when there is any risk of it being confused with similar cables carrying mains voltage. ( as in your case ).

    You need to identify the bell push cable and connect that on the ELV side between one terminal of the transformer and one of the bell terminals. The installation instructions should tell you exactly which terminals to use.

    Label the cable as "Door push" to try and ensure is it is NEVER connected to the mains.
     
  13. OwainDIYer

    OwainDIYer

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    2 core cables with brown and blue sounds more like flex to me. :(
     
  14. sleptwithatradesman

    sleptwithatradesman

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    This is what I thought. Any suggestion on how to safely identify the bell wire without a meter? I Wont be able to get my hands on one till I'm back at work after the holidays.

    thanks.
     
  15. OwainDIYer

    OwainDIYer

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    Argos have a test meter. They're open on Christmas Eve and you can take it back on Boxing Day for a refund.
     
  16. mattysupra

    mattysupra

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    You do realize that doing such act's leaves the returned item 'used' so this means the item cant be used again. Its sold for cheap to market traders etc.

    The knock on effect is we all now pay more for goods as Argos etc has to cover the costs of people doing as you suggest.

    We wonder why the U.K shops etc are having to turn to china etc for cheap products to help absorb the costs of people 'taking things back that have no fault' but we then moan that nothing is made in the U.K any more and the U.K has many people out of work.

    These people out of work WE pay for out of our taxes. Our taxes are going UP because we in the U.K take the pee.

    Great advice that mate on a open forum . One person tells another etc and all of a sudden your post has reached thousands of people. Those thousands of people are now costing ME more money to-

    1- purchase the product
    2- in taxes i pay


    I watched a interesting programmer the other night, apparently we would only be paying a 1/3rd of marked up prices for products if people didnt steal stuff. That would be like a triple pay riseĀ¬!
     
  17. EFLImpudence

    EFLImpudence

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    Yes, quite.

    I was working in a house once where the people had just moved in.

    The 'lady' of the house had kicked over a tin of paint onto the carpet. She was really upset as they had not yet taken out insurance. I did feel very sorry for her even though it was her fault.
    However, that soon disappeared when she then had the gall to tell me that she had, in the past, claimed several times for new carpet when she had not spilled paint on it - something for which I must have helped pay.
     
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